Loving the piracy debate, I paused it while this point was fresh in my mind to post this.
After Rob (I think) went into detail about the power of words and refusing to use anything other than "piracy" because that's what people call it this was followed by another section on how it got there in the first place. The obvious was accepted that it's repeated ad-infinitum by the mainstream media outlets so we end up parroting it ourselves......he then states it's "stealing". Another of the buzzwords used by the same outfits to frame the debate in their favour.
It's "copyright infringement" it's not "stealing". That doesn't make it right or legal, but as stated, words have power, you should use them properly, specially if you decide you have a high horse to get on about that very subject.
The analogue and digital world are very different. In the analogue world you have limited numbers of anything, if one is stolen, you are one less. The digital world means that everything is a copy of that same file, copied on demand. If one is copied without payment, you don't lose the original, nor the ability for that original to be copied on demand.
You can't lose something you never had, Losing revenue from an unauthorised copy assuming that every one is a lost sale has been debunked so many times it's hilarious that anyone believes it now.....but that brings us back full circle with the "repeat some bogus claims often enough and people believe them".
Mintcast 94
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ThistleWeb
Mintcast 94
Last edited by LockBot on Wed Dec 07, 2022 4:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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tdockery97
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Re: Mintcast 94
That's really an interesting (and controversial) area of conversation. I think the powers-that-be know very well what is what as far as strict legality. For instance, if you get caught downloading a copyrighted movie via torrent, they don't nail you for getting that copy. They get you for seeding (aka distributing) it to others. 
Mint Cinnamon 20.1
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ThistleWeb
Re: Mintcast 94
Another couple of analogies which emphasise how bogus the "copyright infringement" = "stealing" argument is. For this to be true, the original must change it's state to reflect the fact that it no longer exists, or one less of it exists after one is stolen.
When you visit a website like this one, the server copies the contents of the page to your PC, which then displays in your browser (yes this has a database and PHP but we'll keep it simple). If copy=steal was true, the first person to visit the site would own the content. It wouldn't be on the server for anyone else to see. It existed until someone stole it, now it does not. The fact that the site was designed meant that the designers of PHPBB managed to get around this anomaly to create the software, then the Mint team managed the same magic spells to install and set up the forums, then people with no technical knowledge whatsover manage to weave that same spell when they visit the site.
Another analogy:
When you load a program on any OS on any device, it copies the data from the long term storage (CD, HD etc) to RAM so it can be manipulated in whatever way it's meant to be. If copy=steal was true, it'd no longer exist on the HD when it was in RAM. I'd love to see the magic spell NAS designers use to magically have that same data available to multiple users at the same time if it exists only on one users RAM at any one time like a library book.
The problem is that most people don't think about the words they are using, and parrot what they hear over and over. Increasingly, those arguments used by the RIAA and MPAA are falling on deaf ears. More and more people are aware of it, they are aware of what it REALLY is, and don't agree with the stance these front groups are shoving down their throats.
This is why these front groups need to astroturf, to bully and bribe others to back their causes. By comparison, there are millions of REAL grass roots folks who are opposed to what they want. the most logical way to look at things, is to ask one simple question:
If these groups are correct in their statements, if they are accurate in their estimates, if they are in context to the size of the issue and everything else around it........why the constant lies, deception, astroturfing, fake studies, behind-closed-doors-agreements etc? If their case is so solid, and so obvious, why lie? By lying they are admitting the facts don't match the narrative they're trying to spin.
It's worth noting why these front groups are determined to (knowingly and wrongly) classify copyright infringement as theft; copyright infringement comes under civil law, while theft comes under criminal law. This means a much wider range of powers and punishments are available for theft, than simple civil matters.
When you visit a website like this one, the server copies the contents of the page to your PC, which then displays in your browser (yes this has a database and PHP but we'll keep it simple). If copy=steal was true, the first person to visit the site would own the content. It wouldn't be on the server for anyone else to see. It existed until someone stole it, now it does not. The fact that the site was designed meant that the designers of PHPBB managed to get around this anomaly to create the software, then the Mint team managed the same magic spells to install and set up the forums, then people with no technical knowledge whatsover manage to weave that same spell when they visit the site.
Another analogy:
When you load a program on any OS on any device, it copies the data from the long term storage (CD, HD etc) to RAM so it can be manipulated in whatever way it's meant to be. If copy=steal was true, it'd no longer exist on the HD when it was in RAM. I'd love to see the magic spell NAS designers use to magically have that same data available to multiple users at the same time if it exists only on one users RAM at any one time like a library book.
The problem is that most people don't think about the words they are using, and parrot what they hear over and over. Increasingly, those arguments used by the RIAA and MPAA are falling on deaf ears. More and more people are aware of it, they are aware of what it REALLY is, and don't agree with the stance these front groups are shoving down their throats.
This is why these front groups need to astroturf, to bully and bribe others to back their causes. By comparison, there are millions of REAL grass roots folks who are opposed to what they want. the most logical way to look at things, is to ask one simple question:
If these groups are correct in their statements, if they are accurate in their estimates, if they are in context to the size of the issue and everything else around it........why the constant lies, deception, astroturfing, fake studies, behind-closed-doors-agreements etc? If their case is so solid, and so obvious, why lie? By lying they are admitting the facts don't match the narrative they're trying to spin.
It's worth noting why these front groups are determined to (knowingly and wrongly) classify copyright infringement as theft; copyright infringement comes under civil law, while theft comes under criminal law. This means a much wider range of powers and punishments are available for theft, than simple civil matters.