Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

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BenTrabetere
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by BenTrabetere » Mon Jan 29, 2018 1:24 pm

BigEasy wrote:
Linkdead_ wrote:Why is it that so much software is not made available on Linux?
Mostly because Linux very often reinventing the wheel: X11, Wayland, Mir, GTK 1, 2, 3, Qt, Unity - progressive and great, Unity - canceled (appeared bad?)... e.t.c, e.t.c, e.t.c. Very few wants to mess with this chaos.
And yet cross-platform open-source ventures like LibreOffice, GIMP, RAWTherapee, Scribus, MuseScore, et al, do not seem to have any problem managing "this chaos," as well as the chaos Microsoft and Apple have foisted over the years. Or are you suggesting developers at MuseScore are better than their counterparts at Sibelius?

This excuse is almost as feeble as the 'too many package managers and desktop environments' to support excuses. They are not insurmountable obstacles.

The reason a Linux version of iTunes is not available is not because Apple does not have the expertise to create one. For starters, Linux is a very real threat to macOS.

Adobe does not have to support Linux, and there is not a significant economic reason for it to support Linux. On the other hand, Adobe has to support macOS and it would face severe economic pressure if it were to abandon Apple.

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by thx-1138 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 1:36 pm

BenTrabetere wrote:Adobe does not have to support Linux, and there is not a significant economic reason for it to support Linux. On the other hand, Adobe has to support macOS and it would face severe economic pressure if it were to abandon Apple.
Ditto - and btw, Photoshop specifically, was originally a Mac program.

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by Marziano » Mon Jan 29, 2018 1:45 pm

BenTrabetere wrote: For starters, Linux is a very real threat to macOS.
Would you like to elaborate on that for me to be able to follow the argument? On what front?
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by BigEasy » Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:51 pm

BenTrabetere wrote:And yet cross-platform open-source ventures like LibreOffice, GIMP, RAWTherapee, Scribus, MuseScore, et al, do not seem to have any problem managing "this chaos
How do you know they have no problem? Have! But trying to solve problems for some reason. They want.
Or are you suggesting developers at MuseScore are better than their counterparts at Sibelius?
Better or worse is not question. LibreOffice, GIMP, RAWTherapee, Scribus, MuseScore is open source, GNU, free softwares (read - not responsible for nothing. working or non working is your problem, not their.). Sibelius is commertial closed source. They just don't want to be responsible for non working their software (for example for your Linux Mint).
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by whm1974 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:20 pm

Marziano wrote:
BenTrabetere wrote: For starters, Linux is a very real threat to macOS.
Would you like to elaborate on that for me to be able to follow the argument? On what front?
I'm not sure about either that as they seem to have a good lock on large numbers of the upscale crowd.

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by Marziano » Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:39 pm

whm1974 wrote:
Marziano wrote:
BenTrabetere wrote: For starters, Linux is a very real threat to macOS.
Would you like to elaborate on that for me to be able to follow the argument? On what front?
I'm not sure about either that as they seem to have a good lock on large numbers of the upscale crowd.
Ya, they seem to have a loyal "fanclub" who is willing to pay for that glowing logo.
No matter how much I personally like using Linux, when it comes to the number of actual desktop users we are still dreaming of passing that elusive 5 % limit of the total.
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by whm1974 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:50 pm

Marziano wrote:
whm1974 wrote:
Marziano wrote:
Would you like to elaborate on that for me to be able to follow the argument? On what front?
I'm not sure about either that as they seem to have a good lock on large numbers of the upscale crowd.
Ya, they seem to have a loyal "fanclub" who is willing to pay for that glowing logo.
No matter how much I personally like using Linux, when it comes to the number of actual desktop users we are still dreaming of passing that elusive 5 % limit of the total.
Well we did reach 3% last year, so we are getting there.

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by Marziano » Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:56 pm

whm1974 wrote: Well we did reach 3% last year, so we are getting there.
A bunch of never-give-up diehards inexorably pushing forwards, 3% hurray :D
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by whm1974 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 8:08 pm

Marziano wrote:
whm1974 wrote: Well we did reach 3% last year, so we are getting there.
A bunch of never-give-up diehards inexorably pushing forwards, 3% hurray :D
I'm wondering if the increase in number of close software vendors moving to the Subscription Model will start pushing users into Linux who don't want to pay a bunch fees just to be able to use their computers?

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by Marziano » Mon Jan 29, 2018 8:53 pm

whm1974 wrote: I'm wondering if the increase in number of close software vendors moving to the Subscription Model will start pushing users into Linux who don't want to pay a bunch fees just to be able to use their computers?
That is certainly a very good reason to choose Linux. But I am afraid most people choose to stay with the platforms they are familiar with, mostly by the force of habit. How much they are willing to pay for that in the long run, I don't know. For many switching to Linux is a "leap of faith" as they express it. I think as it is now, one must like a bit to venture into the uncharted territory somehow.
Linux based operative systems are great as they offer the users great freedom to engage actively with their systems. This freedom is the strength of Linux but paradoxically it can be it's "Achilles heel" as well. Since one can do anything with the system, it is easy that many things can go wrong and you end up with a broken one.
Still many times things break or don't function as they should without, at the first sight, at least, any apparent reason
I, personally, and I believe the majority of the people in this forum, like to spend hours each day to tweak and tinker with our systems. But a great number of people can't afford that in the midst of their hectic lives. So I don't know :|
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by whm1974 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:01 pm

Marziano wrote:
whm1974 wrote: I'm wondering if the increase in number of close software vendors moving to the Subscription Model will start pushing users into Linux who don't want to pay a bunch fees just to be able to use their computers?
That is certainly a very good reason to choose Linux. But I am afraid most people choose to stay with the platforms they are familiar with, mostly by the force of habit. How much they are willing to pay for that in the long run, I don't know. For many switching to Linux is a "leap of faith" as they express it. I think as it is now, one must like a bit to venture into the uncharted territory somehow.
Linux based operative systems are great as they offer the users great freedom to engage actively with their systems. This freedom is the strength of Linux but paradoxically it can be it's "Achilles heel" as well. Since one can do anything with the system, it is easy that many things can go wrong and you end up with a broken one.
Still many times things break or don't function as they should without, at the first sight, at least, any apparent reason
I, personally, and I believe the majority of the people in this forum, like to spend hours each day to tweak and tinker with our systems. But a great number of people can't afford that in the midst of their hectic lives. So I don't know :|
Well my Dad has Mint on his laptop and Manjaro on his desktop, and I get zero phone calls from him about any problems. Back when he was using Windows he had all kinds of issues.

With Mint at least when properly setup, non-tech mind folk can easily use Linux without any issue.

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by Marziano » Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:13 pm

whm1974 wrote: Well my Dad has Mint on his laptop and Manjaro on his desktop, and I get zero phone calls from him about any problems. Back when he was using Windows he had all kinds of issues.
:lol: , yeah, you are right, I have perhaps generalized my own way of doing things. I shouldn't have :) By The way, I run also both Manjaro and Mint. Both great distros. I enjoy them differently but equally as much. I guess a great deal depends on your computing habit. Mint pursues a developing model which offers god stability. For many people, it is very appealing and convenient. I find Manjaros rolling model interesting since things get patched and fixed all the time and they have a focus on stability as well. But anyhow my generalization is inexcusable, I am sorry :)
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by whm1974 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 9:24 pm

Marziano wrote:
whm1974 wrote: Well my Dad has Mint on his laptop and Manjaro on his desktop, and I get zero phone calls from him about any problems. Back when he was using Windows he had all kinds of issues.
:lol: , yeah, you are right, I have perhaps generalized my own way of doing things. I shouldn't have :) By The way, I run also both Manjaro and Mint. Both great distros. I enjoy them differently but equally as much. I guess a great deal depends on your computing habit. Mint pursues a developing model which offers god stability. For many people, it is very appealing and convenient. I find Manjaros rolling model interesting since things get patched and fixed all the time and they have a focus on stability as well. But anyhow my generalization is unexcusable, I am sorry :)
To my knowledge, he hasn't even booted into Windows 8.1 even once since I built his system back in the middle of 2014. Personally I rather have used the extra cost for an SSD or better CPU. But he wanted Windows just in case he had to go back to Cricket internet.

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by BenTrabetere » Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:41 am

Marziano wrote:
BenTrabetere wrote: For starters, Linux is a very real threat to macOS.
Would you like to elaborate on that for me to be able to follow the argument? On what front?
Not only has Apple not developed for Linux, it has gone out of its way to make it difficult to use iThings with a Linux PC. Both Linux and macOS are Unix-like operating systems, and both have a similar market share. Developing a Linux version of iTunes should not be difficult.

Apple has to support Windows. The market demands it. Sales of iPhones and iPads would evaporate if there were no way to connect them to a Windows PC. A Linux version of iTunes would would give people an alternative to Windows and macOS, and that would definitely not be in Apple's best interest.

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by BenTrabetere » Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:13 am

BigEasy wrote:
BenTrabetere wrote:And yet cross-platform open-source ventures like LibreOffice, GIMP, RAWTherapee, Scribus, MuseScore, et al, do not seem to have any problem managing "this chaos
How do you know they have no problem? Have! But trying to solve problems for some reason. They want.
Whether they have a problem is largely irrelevant. The fact that these applications exist for Linux and other platforms demonstrates they are able to address the "chaos" issues you raised.
Or are you suggesting developers at MuseScore are better than their counterparts at Sibelius?
Better or worse is not question. LibreOffice, GIMP, RAWTherapee, Scribus, MuseScore is open source, GNU, free softwares (read - not responsible for nothing. working or non working is your problem, not their.). [/quote]
I am not chasing your open-source red herring. I will, however, point out there are Linux versions of proprietary cross-platform software. Softmaker Office and FreeOffice, MasterPDF Editor, XnViewMP, and Sublime Text are a few examples. These developers also are able to address the "chaos" issues you raised.
free softwares (read - not responsible for nothing. working or non working is your problem, not their.).Sibelius is commertial closed source. They just don't want to be responsible for non working their software (for example for your Linux Mint).
Have you ever read an EULA that guaranteed anything more than a refund? "Closed source" does not suggest, imply or establish responsibility or additional responsibility on the part of the developer.

I read the EULA for Sibelius, and it does not provide any additional protections than what the license for MuseScore offers. The Sibelius EULA does allow Avid to collect data from its Users, share that data with 3rd parties, and terminate your license without prejudice.

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by Marziano » Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:40 am

BenTrabetere wrote: Not only has Apple not developed for Linux, it has gone out of its way to make it difficult to use iThings with a Linux PC. Both Linux and macOS are Unix-like operating systems, and both have a similar market share. Developing a Linux version of iTunes should not be difficult.

Apple has to support Windows. The market demands it. Sales of iPhones and iPads would evaporate if there were no way to connect them to a Windows PC. A Linux version of iTunes would would give people an alternative to Windows and macOS, and that would definitely not be in Apple's best interest.
It is much more clear to me now, I got the picture. Thank you!
cheers
:D
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by Marziano » Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:06 am

whm1974 wrote: To my knowledge, he hasn't even booted into Windows 8.1 even once since I built his system back in the middle of 2014. Personally I rather have used the extra cost for an SSD or better CPU. But he wanted Windows just in case he had to go back to Cricket internet.
That sounds great!
Me too, I have still Windows in some partition. I kept it there for a just-in-case scenario but now I feel that it is just wasting space there. Curretntly I just use Mint and to somewhat lesser extent Manjaro. I have them set up in another drive to have a backup and therefore I feel I can be more adventurous in my approach and experimenting. It happens that I do a fresh install to begin with a clean sheet but that happens less often nowadays.
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by BigEasy » Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:33 am

BenTrabetere wrote:Have you ever read an EULA that guaranteed anything more than a refund?
Exactly what they do not want to do - too many refund.
"Closed source" does not suggest, imply or establish responsibility or additional responsibility on the part of the developer.
Closed does not, but commertial does.
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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by BenTrabetere » Tue Jan 30, 2018 11:38 am

BigEasy wrote:
BenTrabetere wrote:Have you ever read an EULA that guaranteed anything more than a refund?
Exactly what they do not want to do - too many refund.
Whether you read the EULA is irrelevant. What is equally irrelevant is how it relates to your "chaos" assertion.
"Closed source" does not suggest, imply or establish responsibility or additional responsibility on the part of the developer.
Closed does not, but commertial does.[/quote]
Nonsense. I happen to read the EULA for the software I purchase and use, and nearly every one has clauses that are specifically worded to release the developer from responsibility. This is especially true for the major commercial developers like Microsoft, Adobe, and IBM.

But, again. This has NO RELEVANCE to your "chaos" assertion, and completely ignores the fact there are developers of cross-platform, proprietary, COMMERCIAL software who are able to provide Linux versions of their products, despite the "chaos."

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Re: Why do so many programs not have a Linux port?

Post by oldgranola » Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:06 pm

I have found that most functionality is actually available. Google alternativeto. But think about trying to code for every OS when most of your audience is in one or another? Me, most of my stats and molecular bio like GCG was VMS_VAX back in the day. Had to use a bunch of perl in SUN OX That we only used as users. Now i rely heavily on programs in R like bioconductor which can work in MS crap but works best in unix. Be multi OS. Why care bout religion? That being said, im moving all our home laptops to LM. Not losing any functionality.
comadore, pcDOS, hpux, solaris, vms-vax ....blah blah blah..
Yet I'm still a fn nooob

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