VNC is 'such fun' :-)

[rossdv8]

I've spent the last couple of days trying to do something that should be dead easy.
Before I go on - I'll just say I am not posting a 'Question'. I'm just letting off steam (but not in a bad way).

Ok, so I've used VNC for years. I've set it up to do remote access into customers' computers for years. I got 'out of computing' after a rather nasty hits and run on a motorbike in 2004. I kept working until 2007 but I simply could not run the business any longer and still be fair to customers. I'd been in computing in the 70s, but in 1984 I suddenly had lots of people asking me to fix stuff that the big companies either took too long for or needed a return to depot (about 1200 kilometres) for a 30 minute job in the workshop.

So, VNC. And Mint 20. (Both systems are running on the same network and are running Mint 20.1 Xfce)


Tried a Terminal on the host and 'vncserver'
No go. Nothing

I had not needed VNC for some years, but it can;t have changed TOO much. So let's install a VNC server on the Host, install a VNC client on the Guest and away we go.

Software center only has a few of each, and I'd been happy enough with tightvnc before, so that went on the host.
Both machines are on the same network, so that shouldn't be a drama.
TigerVNC looked ok for the viewer. None of the others I'd used in the past seemed to be in the repos.
.

No go. Nothing.
Turned both Firewalls OFF
No go. Nothing.

Installed x11vnc server and tried again.
nothing.

Installed vinagre
nothing.

Gave up and installed TeamViewer (it had been handy when I was working with a customer hundreds of kilometres away who had Windows).

At last - I had remote access and could do everything I wanted to.
Exited on both and shut down the host and client.

THIS MORNING
Spent the whole morning trying to get TeamViewer alive on the Host.
I can start the daemon, but it only appears briefly and disappears (from the task Manager list).
The Host is listed and recognised - but showing as Offline.

So now I have the same problem with TeamViewer that I had yesterday with 'normal' VNC software.
And again - firewalls are off. Ports are showing where they should be (all numbers are correct) and logs don;t say 'why' this is happening - just that it is.

Ahhh well - back to the drawing board.

Might make a nice coffee first. Arsenic and sugar? do they look much different?

[rene]

This is still current if you substitute tigervnc-scraping-server + tigervnc-viewer for vnc4server + xvnc4viewer: viewtopic.php?t=320929

[rossdv8]

Thanks Rene. I tried the various Tiger bits yesterday - but was working off memory of stuff that 'used to just work'.
I'll have a good read of the post you sent and start again.
After I posted my little rant, I remembered something and edited my x11vnc.service file. Now I have x11vnc server running and ifconfig shows I have a useable IP address. But one viewer lets me into a Terminal, where things like ls and cd work fine, and I can see I am on the host. The other viewers like Tiger just sit there, although I adjusted settings.

Anyway, I'm going to have my morning coffee (almost 1.30pm here) and read the post on that link.
VNC used to just work. This is ridiculous. It is NOT a Mint problem, and that I can get in as a terminal connection, and that TeamViewer worked one time yesterday - suggests a serious USER ERROR.

I know I have at least an 85 IQ - A nice customer printed out a certificate for me years ago...

The silly thing is - I am doing this because I am lazy. The Realtek Audio chip on my main computer died on one channel. I have a Raspberry Pi and a GigglyBit BRIX hooked up to the same monitor as the main computer and using the BRIX for multimedia seemed logical to solve the problem, since I have the HiFi (ish) speaker system now using PulseEffects . But having to switch HDMI ports using the Remote is a pain in the neck when I need to change the volume.

So All I am trying to do is have a window into the BRIX to load music and more importantly, to quickly MUTE or change the volume if someone calls me.

The silly things we do in the name of computing. In the old days we would have just bought a HiFi player.

[rossdv8]

U P D A T E

I decided I was not going to let this thing beat me. I mean, before the brain injuries I could do it without even thinking about it. And I can follow a few online tutorials - shirley . . .
So I just spent an afternoon doing exactly what I did yesterday after trying some new stuff suggested in Rene's post (after uninstalling everything related to VNC servers and clarinets (auto correct is wonderful) and reinstalling tigervnc.)

It is dinner time.
Tiger seems to be working on the Host using some weird command (something like x0vncserver - I can't remember, and I can't open the other machine in VNC to check). But whatever it is, it works.

However, running the command vncviewer (and the host ip address) returns:
CConn: Authentication failure: Authentication failure: No password
configured for VNC Auth

So I thought 'That's easy - I'll search how to set a password in Tigervnc server. Spent 4 hours and not a single result. Nobody seems to know how to set a password - or at least, they are keeping it a closely guarded secret.
My firewall rules look like a flamin' coal mine. Tunnels everywhere. Or maybe like a container terminal - sending stuff through a hundred ports!

At one point I even uninstalled EVERYTHING (uninstalled Teamviewer and PURGED it) then installed TeamViewer on both machines. FAIL !!
So I purged it again and now only have tigervncviewer on the client and tigervnc-scraping-server on the Host.

I have a feeling that if I can find a way to set a password on the tiger server, or to set the server AND the viewer so they do not need either - it 'might' work.

But I'm not holding my breath, There doesn't seem to be a manual anywhere and there don;t seem to be ANY man pages.

Again - I'm not complaining here - just 'chatting' about the experience of setting up VNC on Mint 20.x.
A sort of tongue-in-cheek How (not) To for anyone else contemplating something similar.




BTW
I should add that almost nothing in this link works, even stuff that is substituted as suggested. Many of the commands like vncpasswd

M93p:~$ vncpasswd
vncpasswd: command not found
ross@ross-ThinkCentre-M93p:~$

simply don't exist - but it filled in a few hours of fun typing stuff and installing and uninstalling alternatives..
viewtopic.php?t=320929

I'll add to the narrative as things unfold, especially if there are any breakthroughs over the the next few days / weeks / months ..

[rene]

I should add that almost nothing in this link works, even stuff that is substituted as suggested.

Can only tell you that it works exactly as suggested on a clean install. Although

Code: Select all

sudo apt-get install tigervnc-scraping-server tigervnc-viewer

should set things up for you automatically, if you have now disturbed the setup too significantly you may have missed the part about using e.g.

Code: Select all

sudo update-alternatives --config x0vncserver

and same for vncserver, vncviewer and vncpasswd.

Moreover, the suggestion in that posted link is to start the server initially without any authentication needed with x0vncserver -SecurityTypes=none even if only as a test, meaning you'd have no need for vncpasswd.

If you still have trouble I can only suggest starting new again but following that post more closely.

[rossdv8]

Thanks Rene
I went down the page copying step by step (after uninstalling and purging everything) and simply substituted where it said to.

When I did:
$ sudo update-alternatives --config x0vncserver
The return was somethinng like:
There is only one alternative in link group x0vncserver (providing /usr/bin/x0vncserver): /usr/bin/x0tigervncserver
Nothing to configure.

So I left it at that.

Starting the server with no authentication, simply generated an error saying there was no authentication.
Running the vncpasswd command - well, you saw what happened there.

Anyway, I wasn't meaning to drag you into 'the adventure', although I am checking suggestions as you make them and I do appreciate it. I'm quite used to purging programs to get rid of config stuff left behind, including where necessary, deleting leftover directories.
That way each reinstall is 'fresh'.
You know it works, and I know it works. The fact that it doesn't work therefore is a bit ridiculous.

I'm sure I'll stumble across a solution somewhere. I'm simply documenting this as a 'humorous' general interest thing, because in my quest for a fix I've discovered there are thousands of others with the same problem across a whole range of operating systems AND even across different versions of various Linux distros where they, like me, had no problems before.

If there is a logical method that produces a result, it will turn up here.

In the mean time I'm going to try the link you sent yet again, and if that fails, PURGE again, and try the other 4 or 5 tutorials one step at a time and see if I missed a step in any of those.

That I can log in and get a Terminal that lets me do shell stuff on the other computer, but I cannot get a desktop, is frustrating. But it is only vinagre that will let me do that. None of the other viewers even connect.
If only vinagre could do Remote desktop . . .

I would even settle for TeamViewer at this point, but TeamViewer only connects from the Host to the Client - which of course is backwards!

[rossdv8]

SUCCESS - of a sort !!
$ x0vncserver -SecurityTypes=none
Starts the tigervnc-scraping-server

$ vncviewer opens the tigervnc viewer dialog and it just lockls up, then times out

However,
typing vnc in the search section of the Menu shows an item - Remote Desktop Viewer.
Clicking that opens the vinagre viewer
Entering the IP address of the Server computer and clicking Connect should open the connection and you just need to resize the window, or click the full screen button.
To find the IP of the Server Open a Terminal on the Server and do:
$ ip address
that will tell you what it is.

I still have no luck whatsoever getting Tiger VNC Viewer to work with Tiger VNC Server, no matter what I do. Nor does it work with various other viewers - EXCEPT, oddly, right now I am writing this on my m93pT, connected to the GigglyBits BRIX through Vinagre (which would not work earlier.

I would like to say it was after a reboot or something equally dramatic, but I had done several.
I would like to say I found the magic 'config file', but I have not found any to edit.

And all the settings I had followed in that link previously have not been changed.

The only thing I did was installed vinagre again, just because I was tired and decided to install ALL available VNC viewers once more then start all over again tomorrow.

U P D A T E
I installed this stuff following instructions in a Step by Step guide, and had also done the same in some other guides.
I was just checking the name of the tiger servery thingy in Synaptic, and saw that there is something called:
tigervnc-xorg-extension
that is NOT INSTALLED, either in the Server, or in the Client !

I can't be sure, but I suspect this might be the culprit that is stopping the tigervnc viewer connecting.
However, now that vinagre is working so well that apart from a tiny bit of keyboard lag I would hardly know I was typing on the Server, I'm a bit loathe to test the idea. I will, of course - but I don;t want to

For now I have music playing on the Media Server, and can instantly drop to it from my main computer simply by using one of the Hot Corners, change volume or whatever then back again the same way.
If I can resize the window to not be full screen I can do it without even using the hotties.

[rene]

I was just checking the name of the tiger servery thingy in Synaptic, and saw that there is something called: tigervnc-xorg-extension that is NOT INSTALLED, either in the Server, or in the Client !

Nor here, so I can at least assure it's not needed for basic operation. It might have something to do with ability to e.g. resize remote screen as you imply would be useful --- can't right now test, but I believe that starting the viewer with an e.g. -geometry 1024x768 parameter already sort of does -- or should -- or might -- or...

Yeah, VNC is a major mess in current distributions, Ubuntu hence Mint not least of all. Because it's much better to rely on huge, opaque, black-box messes for a privacy sensitive application such as remote desktop rather than on straightforward UNIX-native protocols and software combined with ssh, because, <spit>, old, way uncool dude. And Wayland. And stuff. Or something.

[cfb]

Just to add more information to the mix.
This is documentation from Fedora Linux, but is probably also mostly valid here: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/fe ... /TigerVNC/

[rene]

Yes, but careful, that Fedora documentation is about using a standalone VNC server, i.e., one sharing its own private X display, rather than what most desktop users expect: a so-called "scraping" VNC server, which shares a user's existing X display instead; my above linked post/tutorial starts off noting that important difference.

I.e., here we (or I at the very least) are talking about tigervnc-scraping-server rather than the tigervnc-server from the Fedora doc.

[cfb]

@rene: Thanks for pointing out this important difference.
Personally, I have only experience with a standalone server, which is what I have found useful, when a computer was used without a monitor.

[rossdv8]

Thanks Rene.
That's an interesting point, and when I followed the instructions in that link, I made a point of using the tiger-scraping-server. I had tried others but had no luck, although in each case it appeared the server was running. I just could not connect.

It is the next morning, and I am again typing this on the Server, via the VNC.
Got up this morning, turned on the monitor, turned on the Server and ran the one liner bash script on the desktop.

I'll go back and delete or edit the rubbish out of the earlier narrative, now that it it working. I suppose that means MOST of it

I'll expand this bit after I have installed the tigervnc-xorg-extension. If that kills things, I'll note that. If it allows the tiger viewer to work, I'll note that, likewise if it does stuff all.

Then if someone else has a problem doing this, at least there will be something to help them 'explore'.
https://www.linuxmint.com/start/ulyana/
BACK AGAIN !
I installed the tigervnc-xorg-extension and restarted the server, then started the VNC Server.

Next I closed the VNC session on the Guest and tried opening a new session using TigerVNC Viewer and the IP address of the server. That bombed, so I tried various 'logical settings to see what happened. - Nothing.

Next I tried the SSL/SSH VNC Viewer (another I had installed again yesterday. It has a handy little 'FIND Button to look for a running server. - NOTHING, so I went through various settings using the IP address of the Server. NOTHING again !

Last I tried Remote Desktop Viewer (Vinagre) It worked immediately (using the Server's IP Address), and yet again I am typing this using a VNC window into the Server.
Scaling works great. The VNC desktop fits neatly between my docks and panels and Fonts only need to be adjusted a couple of points despite my monitor being 2 metres from my desk.

I can't see why the other viewers are such a pain when I was looking for a 'simple' VNC - but it looks like Vinagre is still dead easy. I just hope it continues to be maintained and stays in the Mint Repository.

Now to finally tidy this narrative into something simple (and hopefully useful)..

[rene]

If things are working now, great. But yes, I'll note that I recently got mightily frustrated trying to get VNC working from Mint's LightDM display manager or even directly as a system service, what with stuff segfaulting left and right. It''s definitely a gigantic mess at the moment.

[rossdv8]

I'm having a problem now with the Mint 20.1 Xfce desktop on the Server, timing out to the Login screen after some time of inactivity. I remember it has been a problem in the past and am trying to find my notes for how I fixed it.
I remember it was also problem on Mint and Cinnamon, so I can'tjust blame Xfce.

In the meantime, I had to switch back to the HDMI source on the monitor that has the Server on it.
And I accidentally started using the Guest machine's (my main computer) mouse - and it was working.
Opened a text file on the Server and tried the keyboard for the Guest. That works also.
So while I have to use the Host's keyboard to start the Server on it, after I have started the Remote Viewer on the Guest, I can simply switch to the appropriate HDMI source and use the Guest's computer for any maintenance.
Saves reaching for a different keyboard every time I need stand alone access to the Server to play a Video (No good over VNC)rather than for Music, which works fine across VNC

That is handy to know, because, while I now 'need to use the Server' to play Music I only need the VNC to adjust volume and add media top play - Saves me having to buy a new main computer because of a dead Audio chip !

Which was the whole reason I began this exercise

[rossdv8]

It gets interestinger and interestinger (for ME at least )

A little bit of thinking, and I have added the startup command to my Session and Startup settings in Mint Xfce on the Server.
Now when i press the power on button on the BRIX, it boots and starts the VNC Server as it Logs In.
Not only that, but it started it with all the Windows open that I had when I did a full shutdown and power off.
This also works on a simple Reboot from inside the VNC session on the Guest.
I'm guessing coming back to where it left off means the state was saved in the Remote Desktop Viewer somewhere - but I will have to do a shutdown and restart from Cold of BOTH computers to test that.
That does however free up one keyboard and mouse for other uses.
It also means that as long as tigervnc-scraping-server is in the Raspberry Pi repos, I will be able to set the Pi up as a VNC Server on the HDMI source where it is living.

For now though, I'm chuffed.
Thanks to Rene for the couple of timely and indispensable hints / suggestions.

Hopefully I can remember EXACTLY what I did that made it work in the end, because what I ended up with is exactly what I used to get with other distributions in the past. I just can't see why it should have been so difficult. More to the point, i cannot see why tigervnc-viewer does not work with tigervnc-scraping-server, even after the extensions are installed. And why the only viewer that seems to work dead easily is GNOME's vinagre Remote Desktop Viewer..



The Bookmarks Toolbar shows only a fraction of the resources I had to search to find some answers (NONE of which actually worked..)
The rest I had to do the old fashioned way. With a little help from Rene's nudging.

[rossdv8]

OK - The STEP BY STEP
If I have missed something please let me know, but as far as I can tell this is EXACTLY what I did to get this to work EASILY.

Also - it doesn;t use a PASSWORD to log in and I don;t think it is using SSH - it is NOT Secure.


NOTE if you are new to Terminal commands - you DO NOT type the $ character
Just the command after it. Copy and Paste makes it easier to get it rght.
After the first sudo command in s session you will have to enter your root Password.
For the next lot,if you keep that Terminal open and just type where the $ has reappeared, you probably won;t need the Password.
If you close the Terminal you will need it again.

********************

FIRST :-

In a Terminal on the machine that will be the Server:

$ sudo apt-get install tigervnc-scraping-server


And in a Terminal on the Machine that will be the Guest
(The machine you will use to VIEW and Control the VNC Session):

$ sudo apt install vinagre



Next in a Terminal on the Server:

$ sudo update-alternatives --config x0vncserver
It might come back with a message that there is nothing to update. I ignored it and continued.

Once that has finished, in the Terminal:

$ ip address

Look for something that contains stuff like
" <BROADCAST,MULTICAST,UP,LOWER_UP> mtu 1500 qdisc fq_codel state UP group default qlen 1000
link/ether 00:23:24:98:ae:fe brd ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
inet 192.168.1.123/24 "
write down the numbers like 192.168.1.123 (yours will be different)
DON'T lose them - they are important !! You WILL use them soon on the other computer.

Next, on the Server in the Terminal, do:

$ x0vncserver -SecurityTypes=none

After a few moments it should say it is listening on "5900" or something similar.
AGAIN - write down the number it is listening on.

In a Terminal do

sudo ufw enable
sudo ufw allow 5900/tcp
sudo ufw allow 5900/udp
sudo ufw disable
sudo ufw enable


N O W

Back to the other Computer (The Guest)

Open a Terminal and do the following (same as before), substituting your port numnber where I have 5900:
sudo ufw enable
sudo ufw allow 5900/tcp
sudo ufw allow 5900/udp
sudo ufw disable
sudo ufw enable

Check your Menu
In the search field type vnc
You should see an icon for 'Remote Desktop Viewer'

Start that. Resize it to something you can work with.
At the top left there's a button saying 'Connect' - Click it.
Choose VNC for the Protocol
Where it says Host: enter the IP address (like 192.168.1.123)
In the options, choose 'Scale' and 'keep aspect ratio'
Click Connect at the BOTTOM Right
Wait a few moments and if all went well you should see the desktop of the Server (the other computer).

You can do a couple of things right now to make life easier.
Open your Desktop Settings and make the Desktop Fonts the right size to look comfy.
Do the same for yoour other Font settings.

LAST !!

You can add the start command for the Server

x0vncserver -SecurityTypes=none

to your Session and Startup - Autostart Applications usind the 'ADD button' and the 'Command' Box.
That will start the VNC Server automatically whenever the Server is turned on and logs in, even if you haven't started your everyday work machine.

Then when you want to, just run the Remote Desktop Viewer and it is already waiting.

It is probably not correct to set the ports up on BOTH machines, but I did, because nothing else had worked up to that point.

*****************

I hope this helps someone avoid the hours of searching and trial and error (mostly error) I went through.

[rossdv8]

OK - to hopefully finish this exciting VNC experience, I went through the commands I used to get the BRIX working as a VPN Server and repeated them one by one on my Raspberry Pi. I discovered that vinagre Remote Desktop Viewer, which was still running with the BRIX desktop open, can open the Pi as well by simply clicking the Host: field and typing in the Pi's IP address.
vinagre Remote Desktop Viewer then opens the new Client in a TAB, and everything works as normal. Switching between machines is done with just a click on a tab.
Of course, tigervnc-scraping-server needs to be running on those machines (obviously)

OK, these are the commands that need to be typed into the Terminal on a Mint 20.x computer, or for that matter, a Raspberry Pi make it a VNC Server.
The $ prompt is listed only ONCE at the start, to make it easier to copy and paste EACH COMMAND individually.
In a Terminal on the Mint 20.x machine that will be the VNC Server:

$
sudo apt update
sudo apt install tigervnc-scraping-server
sudo apt install ufw
sudo enable ufw
sudo ufw allow 5900/tcp
sudo ufw allow 5900/udp
sudo ufw allow ssh
sudo disable ufw
sudo enable ufw
ip address
x0vncserver -SecurityTypes=none

After you type ip address in the Terminal you will get a block of text. Amongst it will be the word inet and an IP address. Write that down to use in the Remote Viewer.

For the machine that will be the Guest / Client (Remote Desktop Viewer): See the post above this one . .

[rene]

Thanks for summarizing

[rossdv8]

Thanks for the help Rene.
I couldn't see why something that used to be so simple didn;t work. And searches found a heap of stuff that 'should work', but didn;t. I also didn;t intend this to be any sort of instructional thing. I jusp planned to 'chat' about the experience because it was, indeed, fun - although frustrating. I also didn;t know you had been through and experienced the VNC changes.
I just hope vinagre Remote Desktop Viewer continues to be maintained and STAYS ion the MINT REPOS. It doesn;t allow cut and paste between Server and Guest but it was the only Client that worked.

[rene]

Haven't personally found a VNC client yet that did NOT work with tigervnc-scraping-server on the server but I'll take your word for it. The UFW-crapola in your description is something that I very much not concern myself with by design: using a firewall on an individual Linux Mint system, i.e., behind a router-based firewall and/or NAT already, tends to be quite a bit worse than useless what with it interfering with legitimate LAN traffic for no reason whatsoever other than ghosts of Windows-past. Am as such very much of the inclination that anyone who enables one gets what they deserve...