My review of Mint 18

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rajapatta
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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by rajapatta » Sat Sep 17, 2016 6:14 pm

Good afternoon,
My name is Raja. I am trying to install linux mint 18 on my desktop. I downloaded 32 bit version and created a DVD ISO. I inserted the DVD into the Drive and tried starting the machine. I keep getting the error message "Boot Failure" "Press any key to continue".

Please help.

Thanks

Raja

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by kb9qhd » Sat Sep 17, 2016 9:24 pm

My frustration with screensaver is extreme. I do not want to disable - just destroy its existance.
HOW DO I uninstall, erase, etc. mate-screensaver from my system.

Will re-naming the files in the 'bin' directory to saver-old saver-old-common work.

I do not like it interrupting youtube, vlc, mpv, mplayer, or anything else. The saver is activating every 12 minutes now.
considering emailing mushroom clouds to the creators.

Linux Mint Team. Do better disabling for this at system level or eliminate from distro installation[/quote]


> Um...all of those settings are easily accessed in the control panels. I agree the defaults are too aggressive about turning the screen off but also super
> easy to change.
> Screen saver setting: http://i.imgur.com/SajARu8.png
> Power Management: http://i.imgur.com/SNkzZw2.png[/quote]

Those Settings do not work, I have tried them before.
At this time I really want to eliminate the SAVER from my system. Is it possible.

deleted

Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by deleted » Sat Sep 17, 2016 10:10 pm

No responses from the OP, so my take is that he just wanted to stir the pot.
-Hinto

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by Moem » Sun Sep 18, 2016 3:43 am

rajapatta wrote:Good afternoon,
My name is Raja. I am trying to install linux mint 18 on my desktop.
Hello Raja, please start a new thread for your question. This is a thread about a review, and it's in the Chat section, and your question is a support question about installation. Not a good fit.
Besides, a new question deserves a new thread.
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If your issue is solved, kindly indicate that by editing the first post in the topic, and adding [SOLVED] to the title. Thanks!

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by Seffis » Sun Sep 18, 2016 6:10 am

I have used Linux Mint Cinnamon 18 since it was officially released and have had only one freeze that lasted a few seconds.

The good?

The brightness controls work, out of box, before splash screen or it dims to an acceptable level three-fourths of the way through the splash screen. I customized the grub, LM logo on splash screen, installed brightness applet and edited files in more than one place to get the [FN] brightness controls working and dim the screen before the log in window in previous versions of 17.x.

The WiFi still disconnects frequently on a weak, open G network, but reconnects quickly without having to switch the WiFi off and on in the network manager. And yes, I installed the 3rd party drivers during install. It can also connect, and do low bandwidth browsing (forums, hex chat) when Windows fails with 'cannot connect' or 'limited access.'

Psensor shows disk temperature without me having to to run "sudo HDD -d -uf -n /dev/sda" every log out, reboot, or restart.

The bad?

At least a couple applications in the menu would not launch; Font Viewer (fixed by update) and New Login (ERROR: Cannot start new display.) Also, cannot switch user without logging out. Same error.

Disk drive over-heating. Possible causes?
3000 lines of ureadahead not finding files or directories, that I see no point of loading, anyway, in one day, in Syslog. Network manager writes a chapter in at least 3 logs when it disconnects and reconnects. Followed by NTPD adding another 20 or so lines polling servers and returning null.
And do not forget Firefox browser constantly thrashing disk confirmed on Windows. I haven't installed iotop to see if 'cinnamon --replace' is still the #1 offender.

Work around: Keep a small fan blowing on me and laptop. Not such a problem in Windows except when defragging, disk scan, or maybe recording videos.

Not a bug? Extremely annoying; System Monitor; Dire warnings 'your computer will explode' when ending NTPD and them having to click "End Process" again, in that text box. Where is the check box "DO NOT SHOW THIS AGAIN?" Then, having to type password in yet another text box.

NTPD restarting itself after ending!!!

Return from virtual terminals [F1]-[F6] sometimes results in frozen (except for pointer) or black screen. Log Out from root user sometimes results in black screen.

Several+ other bugs / errors that are already known in the Syslog and maybe a couple fixed?

And don't forget horizontal screen tearing when scrolling down a long page (like this post is getting), fixed by creating a config file and editing a couple settings in Firefox config.

Almost forgot VLC, as it is pre-installed, and tested, I consider it part of the Mint package. When the visualization 3D spectrum is chosen it immediately closes, exits or just disappears.

Do I need a fly swatter or an exterminator? Maybe if me and the Mint team keep stomping we'll eradicate them before 19.x?
Toshiba C655-S5549 Intel I3 dual core Intel Graphics 3000

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by The Old Timer » Mon Sep 19, 2016 2:40 pm

My Linux Mint Mate 18 runs well on several of my 6 to 10 year old desktops. I had a few minor issues with a wireless adaptor but removed it and connected a hard wire and all is well.

I don't like the fact that some apps have either been removed or upgraded to a newer version which doesn’t work or only partially works.
Google Earth will only partially work so that is a disappointment, the newer version of Unetbootin doesn't work.

I can't say that LMM 18 is anything any more special or any better than LMM 17.1 as I haven't found it to do any more than what I'm able to do using LMM 17.1. I also haven't seen any of the so called great new features that I read about in all of the reviews. I guess "Systemd" is the big new feature and why that is supposed to be great I haven't quite seen yet.

Linux Mint Mate 18 is a good choice for my old computers and it does work well on the computers I have installed it on. I guess with all new OS releases it takes time for some of us to see the new features and changes. The more I use it the more I find it to be as reliable and stable as Linux Mint Mate 17.1. I'm happy with it. :)

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by mike acker » Mon Sep 19, 2016 5:35 pm

i, for one, will be eternally grateful for the magnificent effort our team has made in providing these wonderful MINT alternatives!

I have a MINT 18 Cinamon running on my test box ( #2, below ); also a 17.3 version, an LMDE/2, and a MINT 18 / KDE

these all work -- which is why I say -- all of this is a Magnificent Effort -- and the Team is to be Commended!

my personal preference continues to be the LMDE/2 version -- I think I just relate to it better; Too, I've had good luck with Backports in LMDE/2 -- particularly the DARKTABLE program--

One of the things I've been fussing over is the "KDE" programs -- e.g. Gwenview -- which is my favorite image browser;
the KDE programs all seem to run fine on the LMDE/2 system,-- on the MINT /18 -- it gives an error "unable to list URL"; I expect this'll get cleared up after a bit,--

In the meantime I used the SHOTWELL editor instead -- and that's been an interesting experience -- it creates an index to all my images -- and I found some stuff I forgot I had!

I've had trouble using VLC to view some videos on LMDE/2 -- but -- the "Videos" player seems to work fine; ( VLC seems to be missing an audio CODEC -- ? ) ;

MINT 18 , MINT 17.3, and LMDE -- all are working properly with Oracle/VirtualBox -- and my appliance ( WIN8.1) export worked properly when imported in the MINT18 and LMDE/2 systems; This is encouraging;

every computer system seems to have the little minor items -- but we mustn't see these minor things out of proportion with the overall accomplishment -- especially when work-arounds are usually easy to find ;
¡Viva la Resistencia!

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by linx255 » Wed Sep 21, 2016 11:08 am

Your experience does not match mine at all. Perhaps your BIOS contains power management code? You should check because this is not a MATE problem. My wife has MATE on her laptop and the controls work exactly as they should.
I disabled the bananas out of my BIOS PM.
Xset controls the X display, not sure if that talks to BIOS, but the 'dpms' setting I must to set off.
Even then the screen still blanks at the login page just after boot, presumably because my scripts haven't run.

But maybe the PM isn't consistent across machines / installs or maybe my machine is a piece of garbage.
My motherboard is pretty standard for a desktop PC. I'd be surprised if your PM on your laptop is off by default and mine is not.
I'm curious what your

Code: Select all

xset -q
gives you after just logging in after startup.
But still I think it would be nice if there was a switch on installation and in control center -> power management to enable / disable xset options.

And Oh, one other thing, many of the built-in apps in Mate don't conform the selected theme colors. For example, my colors are dark with yellow and orange, and yet 'xed' and 'mate-system-monitor' appear white with blue. :roll:
- I'm running Mint 18 Mate 64-bit
- 4.15.0-34-generic x86_64
- All my bash scripts begin with #!/bin/bash

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by Portreve » Sat Sep 24, 2016 7:12 pm

It would be nice not to get the flashing on web pages when certain kinds of elements are brought up (like, on FB, when you're watching a video in the pseudo-theater mode it uses), and I'm not necessarily 100% on board with systemd (though I guess it basically does work) but it's been pretty darned solid.
I have to leave so I can get home by the time I arrive.

Presently rocking LinuxMint 19.1 Cinnamon.

Remember to mark your fixed problem [SOLVED].

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by millpond » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:07 pm

The OP has made some excellent points on his blog, though for poor Ian I would say that correlation does not imply causation.

But with the founder gone, Debian was more easily swayed into destroying its original mandate - albeit in an extremely subtle way. Revolutions (for good or ill) rarely come quickly. They come in irreversible, but tiny steps.

The typical user does not work under the hood of Linux. Some of us find that hood to be an annoyance and either remove it, or replace it with submarine door screening. Those who have worked with innards, often for years perfecting applications and scripts for management of apps and servers - are often appalled by what they now see as the *direction* Linux is taking.

Systemd breaks things. And even when removed (shimmed) alot of things stay broke. The typical consumer user would never notice the difference, or even care about it. They would just wonder what all the fuss is about. The major problem is that most of the IT mainstream media are run by folks who are experts at social media and multimedia apps and are totally clueless to the intracacies of servers, development, and fine tuning and customizing systems at the command line level.

There of course many other choices, such as the compilation distros like Arch. There customization is ultimate, and the user can choose their 'direction'.

But for large systems such changes can require thousands of hours better spent in more productive enterprises than compiling thousands of packages. Which is why i for example prefer the Debian backbone. And Betsy is a strong contender here as a *permanent* base from which to disconnect from the distro cycle and go rogue.
The other contender is of course Devuan - but the problem with them is their arcane user support using email and IRC.

The ideal solution would be for LMDE3 to adopt a Devuan approach, if not Devuan itself - for more traditional users, and let the consumer crowd deal with the more 'popular' ,if commercialized, Ubuntu Mints.
Some may like the idea of an 'app store' on their machine.
I don't.

It all comes down to the right tool for the right job.
Meself, I prefer the pipe (the heart and soul of Linux!).

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by Pjotr » Thu Sep 29, 2016 1:56 pm

Well, Linux Mint and (to a lesser degree) Ubuntu, were never primarily aimed at the "roll your own" crowd in the first place.

Ordinary desktop users are their primary target group. In that light, systemd is OK for their respective userbases, as long as it gets the (desktop) job done. That's all that matters then, when you get rid of the insane ideological fanaticism that's fueling the systemd controversy.

I'm one of those simple desktop users, and so far it's working well for me. No complaints here. :mrgreen:
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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by InkKnife » Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:15 pm

Personally the whole debate is tedious and, to be frank, the anti-sysD people blew their credibility with me a long time ago with their over the top ad hominem and alarmist, tin foil hat conspiracy theories.
I come from a Mac background and the Mac has gone through 3 architecture changes and two complete code-base swaps over the course of just ten years and each one was met with the same kind of end of the world hysteria by small but very, very loud parts of the community.
The anti-sysD folks are asking us to believe that both Fedora and Canonical are switching to an init system (I know it is more than that) that is unsuited for server use when both companies make all their money selling servers.
i7 3770, 12GB of ram, 256GB SSD, 64GB SSD, 750GB HDD, 1TB HDD, Cinnamon.

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by millpond » Fri Sep 30, 2016 3:23 pm

As someone who regards backwards compatibility as the sine qua non for long term use, I have always disliked Jobs and the Apple 'philosophy'.

The 'typical user' when confronted with a new version simply starts fresh and installs a couple of dozen apps.
Try it with 20,000.

I normally need a system that will allow me to update, and that is a process that takes *days*.

On such a system, systemd breaks things. alot of things encompassing untold man-hours of work.

On win I have utils and scripts going back to 1986. That is a *good* thing. While its true most of it is primitive by today's standards, it is still largely usable (with some notable exceptions, of course).

Redhat and Canonical do not sell servers. They sell customer service. And some commercial software. It is in their interest to make their users dependent on their 'products' to the exclusion of all others. It is called a *business plan*.
This is not a conspiracy, it is Economics 101.

Systemd is like putting a Hyundai engine in a Ford truck and calling it a Ford. It will do everything the Ford engine can do, and perhaps a few things better. But if you spent decades turning Ford street cars into racing vehicles - the result is useless, though for the average user, there would be no difference.

And sometimes no difference is needed. Like a combo Win10 laptop I have that I would happily try out with Sarah. Its not a production machine, and no real personal info on it, and it cant be worse than what is already installed. You can even power it with iOS Jobs Ectoplasm Cell technology, and if can play an entire series of Archie Bunker without a recharge - mores the better.

In fact my only request to Clem is to keep LMDE within the principles of the original Debian corporate charter, while keeping on course with Ubuntu/Mint.
In other words the best of both worlds.

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by DeMus » Fri Sep 30, 2016 5:31 pm

rhY wrote:Former Fanboi checking in:

https://crhylove.wordpress.com/2016/09/ ... disapoint/
For more than half a year I am using SolydK which is based on Jessie 8 and what you write about stability problems is something I don't know. I can honestly say I have never had a system so stable, so great as this one. Sorry Mint, but it is true.
Reason for using SolydK is that I dislike Ubuntu more and more and since Ubuntu is present in Mint I stopped using Mint. I, so to speak, skipped the middle man and am using a system which is based only on Debian.

So, maybe for you things don't work out but that doesn't mean Mint 18 is a bad OS. Plus systemd is working, I prove it.

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by Fred Barclay » Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:20 pm

DeMus wrote: Reason for using SolydK is that I dislike Ubuntu more and more and since Ubuntu is present in Mint I stopped using Mint. I, so to speak, skipped the middle man and am using a system which is based only on Debian.
I have similar reasons for using LMDE (it's been super-stable and I like the Debian base rather than Ubuntu). DeMus, you use SolydK for the KDE interface, right? If there had been an LMDE 2 KDE, do you think you would have used that instead?
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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by DeMus » Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:24 pm

Fred Barclay wrote: I have similar reasons for using LMDE (it's been super-stable and I like the Debian base rather than Ubuntu). DeMus, you use SolydK for the KDE interface, right? If there had been an LMDE 2 KDE, do you think you would have used that instead?
Yes, I use KDE as DE since it is the only one I really like.
When LMDE would have a KDE version I am sure I would use that but since Clem and Schoelje divided the DE's (LMDE with Mate and Cinnamon, Solyd with KDE and XFCE) I now use SolydK.
I have used Mint for quite some time and always loved it but, as I wrote, I would like to go away from Ubuntu and still use the stable Debian as foundation. So I ended up with SolydK.

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by InkKnife » Sat Oct 01, 2016 7:50 pm

millpond wrote:As someone who regards backwards compatibility as the sine qua non for long term use, I have always disliked Jobs and the Apple 'philosophy'.

The 'typical user' when confronted with a new version simply starts fresh and installs a couple of dozen apps.
Try it with 20,000.

I normally need a system that will allow me to update, and that is a process that takes *days*.

On such a system, systemd breaks things. alot of things encompassing untold man-hours of work.

On win I have utils and scripts going back to 1986. That is a *good* thing. While its true most of it is primitive by today's standards, it is still largely usable (with some notable exceptions, of course).

Redhat and Canonical do not sell servers. They sell customer service. And some commercial software. It is in their interest to make their users dependent on their 'products' to the exclusion of all others. It is called a *business plan*.
This is not a conspiracy, it is Economics 101.

Systemd is like putting a Hyundai engine in a Ford truck and calling it a Ford. It will do everything the Ford engine can do, and perhaps a few things better. But if you spent decades turning Ford street cars into racing vehicles - the result is useless, though for the average user, there would be no difference.

And sometimes no difference is needed. Like a combo Win10 laptop I have that I would happily try out with Sarah. Its not a production machine, and no real personal info on it, and it cant be worse than what is already installed. You can even power it with iOS Jobs Ectoplasm Cell technology, and if can play an entire series of Archie Bunker without a recharge - mores the better.

In fact my only request to Clem is to keep LMDE within the principles of the original Debian corporate charter, while keeping on course with Ubuntu/Mint.
In other words the best of both worlds.
I will take on that car analogy.
A Ford engine from 1986 is ridiculously primitive compared to the power-plants in brand new cars. It pollutes too much, has a very bad horse-power to cubic inches ratio, gets way too low fuel economy and is far less reliable. The transition from carburetors to computer controlled fuel injection systems obsoleted a vast amount of expertise and during the 80's there was a great out-cry from shade tree mechanics about that very thing.
But what we have gotten from our modern engines is so much better than we ever had it before. Back in the 80's the average lifespan of a car in the USA was 11 years. Today the average age of a car on the road is 11 years. Modern cars last longer, require far less maintenance, get much greater gas mileage and are far more powerful than cars used to be.
In the 80's we had computers that were hilariously under powered and under speced by todays standards. Ram measured in megabytes and nobody had anything put one very slow CPU with a single thread to work with. Today a quad core like I have is very ordinary as is my 6GB of ram and in servers you are looking at common configurations with a dozen cores and threads at the lower end to hundreds of thousands of cores at the high end..
Darn little tech from the 80's is relevant today so I am not surprised your scripts won't work anymore.
Backwards compatibility should be preserved as long as it does not hold back progress and no further.
I do agree that the "Apple way" discards the past too quickly but holding on to the compatibility like Microsoft has resulted in serious problems for them in this fast moving new century.

As for the suggestion that Redhat and Canonical have conspired to push sysD in a deliberate attempt to make Linux crappier and less reliable to increase billing...that is an absurd suggestion that I would place way over there with the other paranoid conspiracy theories that people sling about so casually.
Time marches on and in my over 40 years of being a technology enthusiast I have yet to see tech take a step backwards.
i7 3770, 12GB of ram, 256GB SSD, 64GB SSD, 750GB HDD, 1TB HDD, Cinnamon.

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by millpond » Sun Oct 02, 2016 1:36 am

InkKnife wrote: I will take on that car analogy.
A Ford engine from 1986 is ridiculously primitive compared to the power-plants in brand new cars. It pollutes too much, has a very bad horse-power to cubic inches ratio, gets way too low fuel economy and is far less reliable. The transition from carburetors to computer controlled fuel injection systems obsoleted a vast amount of expertise and during the 80's there was a great out-cry from shade tree mechanics about that very thing.
But what we have gotten from our modern engines is so much better than we ever had it before. Back in the 80's the average lifespan of a car in the USA was 11 years. Today the average age of a car on the road is 11 years. Modern cars last longer, require far less maintenance, get much greater gas mileage and are far more powerful than cars used to be.
...
In the 80's we had computers that were hilariously under powered ....

Darn little tech from the 80's is relevant today so I am not surprised your scripts won't work anymore.
Backwards compatibility should be preserved as long as it does not hold back progress and no further.
I do agree that the "Apple way" discards the past too quickly but holding on to the compatibility like Microsoft has resulted in serious problems for them in this fast moving new century.

As for the suggestion that Redhat and Canonical have conspired to push sysD in a deliberate attempt to make Linux crappier and less reliable to increase billing...

Time marches on and in my over 40 years of being a technology enthusiast I have yet to see tech take a step backwards.
Our car is a 1983 Merc that can drive underwater (with a snorkel) and run without electricity. It will survive the EMP of a nuclear blast, and easily exceed a half million miles, if not more. As a diesel it can run on vegetable oil. At around 30 mpg, its good enough for me.

Our truck is a 1986 chevy, not so good on gas, but only used when needed, and also invulnerable to the stuff that will kill computer chips. Originally a snow plow.

Nothing 'new' can even come close to the reliability and sturdiness of these vehicles.
I am a technologist by trade, not a luddite, but damned, anyone in industry can tell you that production these days has planned obsolescence designed into it. I even need to get vintage garden tools as the newer crap simply does not last.

I beleive in progress in technology, but only when it serves a defined purpose rather than planned obsolescence mandated from marketing departments to drive consumer sales. i have no intention of playing that game. For example, I like the Win2k design and interface. That OS did everything I needed until M$ decided to deliberately deprecate it by blockading it from newer software. Most of my network still runs on XP, though I have a Win7 and Win 10 system here - but I personally rarely use (its for the wife and her classes).

I feel the exact same way about Linux. Most of my old scripts and binary code DO work, though sometimes I need to hack them a bit, like some Perl scripts to keep up with largely undesired innovations that generate 'warnings'. Its not really a problem though.

But what IS a problem is when a major change to the system architecture comes along and breaks things, and the simple parsing of log files no longer works, and some pinhead has decided to alter the way daemons are handled.

Technology is definitely stepping backwards, at least for public users. The market is drifting away from the technological sophistication of desktiops to handheld underpowered toys and thin clients. M$ has led the way with its pied-piper march to the Cloud, with even Linux marching in place with desktop enviroments resembling phone interfaces. Tiles, anyone????

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by InkKnife » Sun Oct 02, 2016 5:30 pm

i7 3770, 12GB of ram, 256GB SSD, 64GB SSD, 750GB HDD, 1TB HDD, Cinnamon.

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Re: My review of Mint 18

Post by millpond » Tue Oct 04, 2016 1:13 pm

The issues raised were not about FUD - there were about *direction*.

For example, the issues raised about Canonical inviting Amazon in were not FUD, but about the issue of turning Ubuntu into an App Store. Everything tales place in small steps, and the next logical progression was an Apple type ecosystem.

Ubuntu is heading in directions far afield from classical Linux. The typical users would never notice until they got under the hood, especially if something went wrong - as can easily happen with driver incompatibilities on newer systems. The good new is that HP seems to be working with Ubuntu on some of its newer systems- which can give Mint a slight edge on newer systems as far as user experience.

LMDE is more classical Debian Linux which is certainly what I prefer, and would use on machines for development, servers, and the like. It runs multimedia just fine. Here system stability trumps 'user experience'.

Diversity is the essential concept for understanding what I am trying to get across. It is good to see a 'forking' here.
Mint going towards the new consumers trying to escape the Redmond and Cupertino Borgs, and hopefully a Debian based (not Redhat based) LMDE that will keep the Betsy format for those of us from the traditional communities.

The ultimate concept is simplicity itself: If the Linux ecosystem is heading toward convergence with the korporate giants - then why bother with it in the first place?

If you cannot see the fundamental philosophical differences between Poettering and Torvalds you are missing a subtlety large enough to drive a carrier task force through.

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