New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

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Citizen229
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New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by Citizen229 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:32 pm

The whiny posts are getting old. New people/maybe trolls are getting old. Mint 17.3 is the last fully polished version of Mint. If you want plug and play install it. Now Mint 18.x is the future. But like all software the future takes time. New people need to be advised if they do not like bugs to install 17.3. There should be a warning on the downloader for God's sake warning total new people of this. People come here for ease. They DL the latest version and they have zero tolerance the bugs. Then they move to other more unstable distros. Then they go back to windows. This fully sets in the windows trap that no one can make an OS like them. The community will not grow when non-tech people use a version that is not yet complete. The fault lies with them for not doing proper research. As well as the fault lies with us for not getting them on a more stable release.

I have not had one bug or bad install using 17.3 on other peoples systems.
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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by Tomgin5 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 2:42 pm

Same here. Good blog! 48 installs and counting. Primarily 17.3 Cinnamon 64.

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by chrisuk » Thu Jan 26, 2017 3:24 pm

Too much of a generalisation, and there's still bugs in 17.3... it's software... so there's bugs.

Also, it depends on what you use your Computer for. My Wife still struggles with text messages and tv remotes, nobody I know can crash a PC/Laptop/Tablet faster than her... the logic of what (and why) she clicks on is beyond even the brightest minds, but she's been using Mint MATE 18 since beta without needing help. She uses Libre Office Write and Calc, and prints to a USB Printer - browses the web with Firefox - and gets her email.
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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by Schultz » Thu Jan 26, 2017 3:35 pm

I haven't come across any bugs in either 18 or 18.1. But then again, I'm not a power user.

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by xfrank » Thu Jan 26, 2017 3:46 pm

I haven't see any bug in LM 18.1
Linux everywhere. Active Distros in my many computers: LM17.3 (Cinnamon, Xfce); LM18.1 (Cinnamon,Xfce); LMDE 2 (Mate), MXLinux (Xfce), Debian 9 (Xfce).

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by Cosmo. » Thu Jan 26, 2017 3:59 pm

The question is not, if there are bugs in LM 18.x. Github is full of them. The point is, that such a thread will not help. My (unlikely to get reality) dream is is Mint 18.2 with no additional features except fixes for (at least most of) them, remove usability regressions and restoring silently removed features. Quality instead of quantity of unready features, which feature especially new bugs.

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by thom_A » Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:52 pm

New people need to learn how to do basic partitioning and multi-booting alongside Windows, if you like. This household have 4 bios machines average 10 years old (from time of purchase) with early Intel dual cores, 3GB ram. One is a laptop. It wasn't easy, it takes time, but you gain experience. (You have to have similar machine you don't care of breaking so you can learn worry-free.)

Over time you never have to struggle which distro to install in your system. You can install 3-4, or even 5. I don't use virtualbox. (I just don't like the idea of running a distro on top of another one. I'd rather multi-boot. Grub Customizer does all the cleaning up of the boot mess for me.)

Mint 17.3 was still installed when I added Mint 18 (now 18.1). I no longer boot in the 17.3 partition. So boot where everything works.

Who's going to test the new version if everyone sticks with old one?

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by Citizen229 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 5:14 pm

"Who's going to test the new version if everyone sticks with old one?"

Having people completely new to linux "test" a new version? Are you serious? Does my post say everyone? No it does not. The average user here is going to be like myself, point and click, then grow out from there. Mint mission is ease of use, which your statement completely contradicts. If we truly cared about ease of use for complete new folks we should be urging them to 17.3.

'New people need to learn how to do basic partitioning and multi-booting alongside Windows, if you like"

You are correct people do need to learn things. We all should want to learn. However with humans, this is not the case. Humans do not all work that way. The average person wants a few clicks to install and be done. When you set the tone for them needing to learn things before they can even install, that opens the door for rejection.
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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by racer-x » Thu Jan 26, 2017 8:03 pm

If I followed your advice (not likely), I would never learn anything. I'm a "new people" to this forum anyway and I always install the latest version of Mint when it comes out. My LM 18.1 Cinnamon has performed perfectly so far. I even installed it on the Wife's Desktop. Everyone is different and you can't generalize something like this.

If you like LM 17.3 then keep using it, but don't tell everyone else they should use it instead of LM 18x.

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by all41 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 8:55 pm

New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.
hogwash--yes 18x works somewhat differently, you have to approach it with that mindset.
New Minters will learn the nuances from the start--whereas 17 users who are unwilling
to commit to change will face difficulties.
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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by The Old Timer » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:09 pm

I've had problems with LM 17.x and LM 18.x but nothing that wasn't able to be solved and both work well on my computers with Intel hardware.
Last edited by The Old Timer on Thu Jan 26, 2017 10:17 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Jim Hauser
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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by Jim Hauser » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:13 pm

I am running 17.3, 18 and 18.1 beta KDE bare metal on 3 different drives. I am not even close to being an expert but dealing with any bugs etc. on the newer versions gets me closer to that instead of dealing with a system that is perfect.

There are experts who are still using 17.3 for good reasons. There are also novices using 18.1 because it is the latest version.

It would be wrong to insist that any user should be pressured into using one released version or another.

For me, 17.3 KDE is very stable and reliable. 18 KDE was very buggy (but fun...) 18.1 beta KDE looks very promising so far.

I realize that not everyone has multiple drives for bare metal testing and multi booting might be difficult for some. What these folks need is good advice from experts. The experts on this forum are my best sources of knowledge. They have given me a lot of good tips and advice. But they have never insisted that I run a particular version (they have made suggestions...)

Cheers!

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by MintBean » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:17 pm

Cosmo. wrote:My (unlikely to get reality) dream is is Mint 18.2 with no additional features except fixes for (at least most of) them, remove usability regressions and restoring silently removed features. Quality instead of quantity of unready features, which feature especially new bugs.
Very unlikely, although I do feel we're seeing quite a focus on squashing bugs and general house-cleaning of the code base. The detailed changelog for 18.1 reveals an impressive number of such related changes. The refresh of the Spices website is currently solving the problem of large numbers of unmaintained and incompatible applets, desklets and themes and I remember Clem mentioning somewhere in the last month or two that there are 100 or so known bugs (papercuts as he calls them) which are high priority.

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by sarge816 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:57 pm

I'm thinking I would definitely recommend 17.3 for current AMD users. We have a pair of PCs with AMD APU powered desktops and 18.x just isn't much of an option at this point. Maybe soon. I would have no problem recommending the 18.x to others using nVidia or Intel graphics systems. Video always seems to be the really big issue - that and System D. But that's another conversation.

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by trytip » Fri Jan 27, 2017 12:01 am

some may argue that just as you are advised to keep your browsers up to date for security patches and vulnerability fixes, so should you keep your kernels and distros. i don't like 18.1 because of the xed applications. why would anyone take a step back in new and updated software. i like my pluma to do my PGP for me but now can't do it in 18.1 :x

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by all41 » Fri Jan 27, 2017 12:19 am

After rereading this thread I realize my reply was pert and uncourteous, and I apologize to Citizen229 (who has a legitimate point of view),and to the forum group.
Sometimes it is hard to remain unemotional--even knowing it is unhelpful
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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by sphyrth » Fri Jan 27, 2017 6:07 am

Serena's Xerus is quite new to the game compared to the Rosa's tried and trusted Tahr.

Even I'm feeling the quirks of Mint 18.1. But not to the point of rage like others have.
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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by Pjotr » Fri Jan 27, 2017 6:26 am

For a near-perfect 18.1 experience, I can recommend the Xfce edition. That's about as good, reliable and bug-free as any OS can get. :)

The official announcement has been made today:
http://blog.linuxmint.com/?p=3222

Get it from the Harvard University mirror:

64-bit: http://mirrors.seas.harvard.edu/linuxmi ... -64bit.iso

32-bit: http://mirrors.seas.harvard.edu/linuxmi ... -32bit.iso

Tip: 10 things to do after installing 18.1 Xfce: https://sites.google.com/site/easylinux ... -mint-xfce

--edit: modified my post to reflect the fact that Mint 18.1 Xfce was announced today.
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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by Hoser Rob » Fri Jan 27, 2017 11:14 am

Citizen229 wrote:The whiny posts are getting old. New people/maybe trolls are getting old. Mint 17.3 is the last fully polished version of Mint. If you want plug and play install it. Now Mint 18.x is the future. But like all software the future takes time. New people need to be advised if they do not like bugs to install 17.3. There should be a warning on the downloader for God's sake warning total new people of this. People come here for ease. They DL the latest version and they have zero tolerance the bugs. Then they move to other more unstable distros. Then they go back to windows. This fully sets in the windows trap that no one can make an OS like them. The community will not grow when non-tech people use a version that is not yet complete. The fault lies with them for not doing proper research. As well as the fault lies with us for not getting them on a more stable release.

I have not had one bug or bad install using 17.3 on other peoples systems.
I don't agree that 17.3 is bug free and necessarily plug in play. But the more I read here and elsewhere about Mint 18 the more I agree with the overall picture presented above. I'm seeing just too many problems reported with 18. I suspect a lot of the issues are with the ubuntu 16.04 base but not all.

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Re: New people need to stop using 18.X and use 17.3.

Post by rdonnelly » Fri Jan 27, 2017 11:53 am

I tried 18.0 and I went back to 17.3 as I use my PC for business purpose, but even some of us vets should stick with a stable release.
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