GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Chat about anything related to Linux Mint
User avatar
Paul_Vandenberg
Level 2
Level 2
Posts: 61
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 9:11 pm
Location: Canada

GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by Paul_Vandenberg »

Has anyone read the plans for GNOME 3.0 and the switch to GNOME Shell? I wonder what this means for Mint and Mint Menu. I guess I will try to keep an open mind, but I hate drastic changes in interfaces.

Click below for more information.
http://live.gnome.org/GnomeShell
User avatar
shane
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 940
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:15 pm
Contact:

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by shane »

I don't like the new menu in KDE4... and now this new direction Gnome is heading in... They both require too many steps to get to what you want to do... too many clicks and too much use of the mouse. If any changes are required, something closer to Gnome Do would be better, or the quick launching feature by simply typing as seen on the Palm Pre. Or why not use voice commands or something? All this waiting for animations to complete, hunting for buttons to click and scrolling and dragging is a regression IMO.

Looking good is a requirement, but not at the cost of being useful and making life easier for the user. This is why I think Compiz is doing well... it looks good but it is not a hindrance for the most part. Speaking of which, I wonder what will become of Compiz after all those man hours that were put into it... Why don't they adopt Compiz instead of building another compositing WM from scratch?

Help me do what I want to do FAST or get uninstalled in a heart beat... which is why Fluxbox stays installed on my machine for the time being.
FedoraRefugee
Level 6
Level 6
Posts: 1274
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 11:25 am

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by FedoraRefugee »

Compiz and Gnome arent exactly in bed together at this point. :(

http://blog.phpwnage.com/article.php?id=62

I like Compiz also, that is the only reason I do not use your version on my laptop Shane. Even though I use Xfce I would sure hate to see compiz get buried due to the direction Gnome is taking. If that happens then I am going fluxbox or maybe windowmaker and I aint looking back...

Though it is just loose talk at this point I am all for a Compiz DE. If steered in the right direction it could be a slick interface.
User avatar
shane
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 940
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:15 pm
Contact:

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by shane »

I also read somewhere yesterday about forking Gnome... dont remember where. If gnome is going to be tied in intricately to GnomeShell then they could use XFCE... and soon the Murrine engine for GTK widgets is going to have real time transparency built in... which will go perfectly with Compiz.

http://www.cimitan.com/blog/2007/12/12/ ... ne-engine/
http://www.cimitan.com/blog/2008/11/16/ ... -projects/
cpatrick08
Level 3
Level 3
Posts: 163
Joined: Sat May 22, 2010 2:17 pm
Location: Huntsville, AL

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by cpatrick08 »

i emailed clem and got this response back

Hi Christopher,

It's hard to say for sure and I'm always open to changing my mind on that kind of things, but from what I can see now, I'd say it's very unlikely. If anything, it's probable we'll disable Gnome-shell from Gnome 3 and keep the panel configuration we've been successfully using until now.
Regards,

Clement Lefebvre
Linux Mint

On 21/06/10 00:48, Christopher Patrick wrote:
i was wondering if you were going to drop the mint menu when gnome 3 comes out and use the gnome-shell
User avatar
DrHu
Level 17
Level 17
Posts: 7522
Joined: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:20 pm

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by DrHu »

The best advice applies, please don't get stuck following windows or Apple OS-X popularity contests
--to see which one can come up with the most obscure tweaks to their respective OS's all in the name of an enriched user experience, where enriched has nothing to do with efficient or productive

Perhaps, they have forgotten that not everyone (even those who are) do not always want to be plugged in, turned on, connected and immediately available on every connection/site that their system has attended to

Sometime we even turn the sound off on TV or mute the commercials. I know that is sacrilege to the marketers, but it is a reality nevertheless.
AndrewH
Level 3
Level 3
Posts: 179
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:51 pm
Location: Vancouver, WA

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by AndrewH »

shane wrote:I don't like the new menu in KDE4... and now this new direction Gnome is heading in... They both require too many steps to get to what you want to do... too many clicks and too much use of the mouse. If any changes are required, something closer to Gnome Do would be better, or the quick launching feature by simply typing as seen on the Palm Pre. Or why not use voice commands or something? All this waiting for animations to complete, hunting for buttons to click and scrolling and dragging is a regression IMO.
I can't speak to Gnome 3, but in KDE4 one can bring up the menu and begin typing to access a program, without clicking through the menu layers.
User avatar
shane
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 940
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:15 pm
Contact:

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by shane »

AndrewH wrote: I can't speak to Gnome 3, but in KDE4 one can bring up the menu and begin typing to access a program, without clicking through the menu layers.
I made that post quite a while ago... I have since got a new laptop with enough horsepower and started using KDE4 on it. And I quite like KDE4 including the menu. My main gripe with it is Nepomuk. It seems like a great idea to help work flow, but I can never get it to work as I expect it to. Also, it does consume a lot of resources. The devs keep saying it is still under heavy development... So for now Nepomuk remains disabled.
User avatar
monkeyboy
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 783
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:30 am

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by monkeyboy »

Paul_Vandenberg wrote:Has anyone read the plans for GNOME 3.0 and the switch to GNOME Shell? I wonder what this means for Mint and Mint Menu. I guess I will try to keep an open mind, but I hate drastic changes in interfaces.

Click below for more information.
http://live.gnome.org/GnomeShell
One thing you can count on with the release of any new piece software is that someone is going to generate opinions. Sometimes the opinions are dead on and sometimes they aren't, however one thing is for sure you have to adapt or move on. In reference to G3 I think its still a little to early for me to render an informed opinion, early test releases only show you so much and it's not till distro developers add it to actual releases that we will get a better feel for its real utility.
If you don't like it, make something better
If you can't make something better, adapt
If you can't do either ball your panties up and cry.

Complaining is like masticating most anyone can do it.
However doing it in public is really hardcore.
frogimus
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 20
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 7:36 am

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by frogimus »

While I'm all for utilizing breakthrough's in processor speeds, memory size, etc I can't help but think that the 2 main DEs are ignoring one of Linux's main strengths - the ability to run on low-end equipment. Even though my machine has a little horsepower, I like running a light environment and watching it respond almost instantly.

I like XFCE and hope that they actually do fork in order to keep it light and tight. Actually, a 3rd fork with more experimental interfacing (as was mentioned earlier) would be nice. Why have your own clone of Plasma or Aero, Mister Gnome? It's already been done. Do something innovative.
shane wrote: And I quite like KDE4 including the menu. My main gripe with it is Nepomuk. It seems like a great idea to help work flow, but I can never get it to work as I expect it to. Also, it does consume a lot of resources. The devs keep saying it is still under heavy development... So for now Nepomuk remains disabled.
I stopped using KDE because of Nepo-muck and to some degree, Strigi and Akonadi. KDE went from user-configurability to "we know what you want and we're gonna shove it at you even if you don't know you want it"
AndrewH
Level 3
Level 3
Posts: 179
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 6:51 pm
Location: Vancouver, WA

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by AndrewH »

shane wrote:I made that post quite a while ago...
Oh, so you did! I didn't realize this was a necro'd thread, I should pay more attention to dates on posts.
User avatar
shane
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 940
Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:15 pm
Contact:

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by shane »

frogimus wrote: I stopped using KDE because of Nepo-muck and to some degree, Strigi and Akonadi. KDE went from user-configurability to "we know what you want and we're gonna shove it at you even if you don't know you want it"
I have Nepomuk, Strigi and Akonadi disabled and uninstalled... because they are still not ready yet, they use take up resources and not enough apps make full use of them... so it's just not worth it. That said, I disagree with the second sentence... I've disabled and uninstalled all the KDE stuff I don't want or use. So choice is still there.
Wamukota
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 29
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 5:44 am
Location: Brugge
Contact:

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by Wamukota »

I do like the current Gnome, especially as it works super on my netbook (1024x600px).

So what does that GnomeShell brings us that we don't already have and that we desperately need.
On http://live.gnome.org/GnomeShell they state:
GNOME Shell is the defining technology of the GNOME 3 desktop user experience. It provides core interface functions like switching to windows and launching applications. GNOME Shell takes advantage of the capabilities of modern graphics hardware and introduces innovative user interface concepts to provide a delightful and easy to use experience.
It provides core interface functions like switching to windows and launching applications ????

Don't we have this already since the dawn of time !!
Administrator http://linuxmintusers.be - The Belgian Linux Mint Website
Ubuntu User #27389
Linux Registered User #391092
ej64
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 323
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 7:43 am
Location: somewhere in Germany

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by ej64 »

Wamukota wrote:Don't we have this already since the dawn of time !!
Well, the point is "introduces innovative user interface concepts to provide a delightful and easy to use experience."

Gnome Shell is document centered. You will usually start a document (music / video ... file) to begin your work, not an application in the first place. Users work on their documents/files -- they do not work with applications in the first place. It's a change of the point of view that may lead to a better usability (esp. with zeitgeist). But maybe not for anybody ...

The same goes for the win/linux topic. Linux is not Windows. If you are coming from Windows you have to open up your mind to be free for something new. But Linux is not for everybody.
Thinkpad X220 with Samsung SSD running Xubuntu 13.04
I'm getting old gladly -- I don't like to die young ...
Wamukota
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 29
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2008 5:44 am
Location: Brugge
Contact:

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by Wamukota »

ej64 wrote:
Wamukota wrote:Don't we have this already since the dawn of time !!
Gnome Shell is document centered. You will usually start a document (music / video ... file) to begin your work, not an application in the first place. Users work on their documents/files -- they do not work with applications in the first place. It's a change of the point of view that may lead to a better usability (esp. with zeitgeist). But maybe not for anybody ...
Thank you for placing Gnome3 in that context. I admit that I never looked at it in that way. Now Gnome 3 has another meaning for me.
Administrator http://linuxmintusers.be - The Belgian Linux Mint Website
Ubuntu User #27389
Linux Registered User #391092
User avatar
viking777
Level 14
Level 14
Posts: 5113
Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2008 11:21 am

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by viking777 »

The best advice applies, please don't get stuck following windows or Apple OS-X popularity contests
--to see which one can come up with the most obscure tweaks to their respective OS's all in the name of an enriched user experience, where enriched has nothing to do with efficient or productive
Hear, Hear!

That kind of thinking killed KDE (which used to be the best DE around) and will probably do the same to Gnome. I am just glad I found Fluxbox in time (although I still like the Mint Gnome interface and I am really pleased to hear that Clem intends to hang on to it).

I am not a developer or programmer, but as an outsider to that realm it strikes me that just making minor improvements to existing interfaces is perhaps a bit boring and tedious whereas building a whole new 'user experience' is challenging and exciting. The coders have fun (and why not - a lot of them do it for nothing) but the end user has to put up with the result which is very often (though not always) worse than what it replaced - I have seen it all too often.
Fujitsu Lifebook AH532. Intel i5 processor, 6Gb ram, Intel HD3000 graphics, Intel Audio/wifi. Realtek RTL8111/8168B Ethernet.Lubuntu 13.10,Ubuntu12.10 (Unity), Mint16 (Cinnamon), Manjaro (Xfce).
Lumenary
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 32
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:55 pm
Location: US-OH-Newton Falls (TZ=EST/EDT)

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by Lumenary »

Howdy...



I did a bit of an (admittedly biased) analysis of Gnome Shell and posted it here:

Based on what Lucas Rocha is saying on his blog, the GNOME organisation has had enough of people (distro packagers) replacing GNOME-developed applications/solutions with third-party products, especially where core User Interface services are concerned.


They have therefore embarked on a path to integrate various parts of the UI so tightly that it would take a lot of effort to create viable alternatives for individual elements.


Sound familiar? It should: Doing just that is what landed Microsoft in Court in the United States on anti-trust charges in 1998:

Not that GNOME is going to end up in Court. That is to say, we all know they aren't going to be forced to defend themselves at a formal, judicial, black-robe-and-gavel proceeding: The collective status of Open-Source-based desktop distributions as "niche" or "hobbyist" operating systems guarantees that the GNOME organisation isn't going to be hauled before a Judge anytime soon. To think otherwise is just plain silly.


However, the Court of Public Opinion is ever present, and wastes no time in making its pleasure or displeasure known...



Best Regards,

Lumenary
US-OH-Newton Falls
TZ=EST/EDT
User avatar
linuxviolin
Level 8
Level 8
Posts: 2082
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 6:55 pm
Location: France

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by linuxviolin »

Clem wrote:If anything, it's probable we'll disable Gnome-shell from Gnome 3 and keep the panel configuration we've been successfully using until now.
A good thing by Clem this time! :mrgreen: If Mint could keep Gnome 3 like Gnome 2, without Gnome- shell and others stupidities, this would be able to be great... Although, for me, the one panel setup is a bad one, I prefer a dual panel setup, but this is another story... :roll:

Or even, why not, just fork Gnome 2, and corrected all its bugs, and stay with it. :idea:
K.I.S.S. ===> "Keep It Simple, Stupid"
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." (Leonardo da Vinci)
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." (Albert Einstein)
User avatar
tdockery97
Level 14
Level 14
Posts: 5059
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:54 am
Location: Mt. Angel, Oregon

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by tdockery97 »

linuxviolin wrote:Or even, why not, just fork Gnome 2, and corrected all its bugs, and stay with it. :idea:
+1
Mint Cinnamon 20
exploder
Level 15
Level 15
Posts: 5564
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2007 10:50 am
Location: HartfordCity, Indiana USA

Re: GNOME 3 and Linux Mint

Post by exploder »

I think gnome 3 will have the option to use the classic menu and turn off gnome shell. I have to go along with what Clem said. I am just not all that crazy about gnome shell, at least not just yet.
Post Reply

Return to “Chat about Linux Mint”