Why not Ubuntu?

Chat about anything related to Linux Mint
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subeh.sharma
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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by subeh.sharma » Sun Jul 31, 2011 2:46 am

I found Ubuntu much better than LM. For e.g. Network printers couldnt be found on my LM but Ubuntu they work flawlessly, Netwkr stream on VLC doesn't detect various channels available, in LM but in Ubuntu, it works just fine! Thumbs up for Ubuntu!

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monkeyboy
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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by monkeyboy » Sun Jul 31, 2011 4:58 am

People often find what they are looking for. If you want to find a problem with Linux, Windows or what have you OS you will probably find it. On the the other hand a little bit of tolerance goes a longways to making things palatable. Same thing with forums, desktop environments or release models if folks want to see a problem to princess about they will find it one way or the other.
If you don't like it, make something better
If you can't make something better, adapt
If you can't do either ball your panties up and cry.

Complaining is like masticating most anyone can do it.
However doing it in public is really hardcore.

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MALsPa
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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by MALsPa » Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:02 am

monkeyboy wrote:People often find what they are looking for. If you want to find a problem with Linux, Windows or what have you OS you will probably find it. On the the other hand a little bit of tolerance goes a longways to making things palatable. Same thing with forums, desktop environments or release models if folks want to see a problem to princess about they will find it one way or the other.
So true.

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by KBD47 » Fri Aug 05, 2011 11:29 am

I actually like Ubuntu and had the intention of using it, until I tried out Mint and Kubuntu--which felt more polished than Ubuntu. What really decided for me was my test drive of the Ubuntu software on live usb. Ubuntu 11.04 Unity desktop looked nice on my netbook, but it didn't work right. Firefox refused to launch from the toolbar. So I decided to back up to Ubuntu 10.04 which felt more stable, except that it would hang up on the "try" or "install" window at bootup on the live usb. I could close the window and 5 minutes later it would be loaded--but what a hassle. I tried Mint 11, but it was slow on my 2 year old netbook. So then I tried Mint 9 and wow, that worked and looked good. It ran fast and didn't hang up on me compared to Ubuntu. It came down to Mint 9 and Kubuntu 10.04 and in the end I installed Mint 9 because Kubuntu got sluggish if I had several web pages open at once as I often do. I was a little concerned about Mint 9 being dated, and I'm not a huge fan of Firefox--feels slow and bloated next to Opera and Chromium. But once I downloaded Opera browser and updated it I was a happy camper with Mint 9 :D

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Aquix
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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by Aquix » Mon Aug 15, 2011 6:52 am

Unity

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by prodigy_ » Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:29 am

Aquix wrote:Unity
Pretty much says it all. Ubuntu lost its way somewhere around 10.04 when the devs first started turning the UI into a poor man's OS X. (Personally, I don't like OS X at all.) They stopped listening to the community and made eye candy their top priority at the expense of customization and productivity. Ultimately they failed everywhere. Unity is ugly, illogical, inconvenient and cumbersome. It was the last straw for me. Canonical made many wrong decisions in the past but as long as I was able to customize my installation according to my needs it all was merely annoying. Unity is a change in Canonical philosophy I can't agree with. It's no longer "for human beings", it's for flashy presentations now.

At the same time I'm very impressed with Mint 11. Ol' good Gnome 2 with nice UI modifications, an excellent choice of default apps. It's perhaps the best-looking desktop Linux distro I've seen in 10 years.
Last edited by prodigy_ on Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:09 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by MALsPa » Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:55 am

prodigy_ wrote:Unity is ugly, illogical, inconvenient and cumbersome.
:lol:

Matter of opinion. I don't see it that way at all.

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by prodigy_ » Tue Sep 27, 2011 12:19 pm

MALsPa wrote:Matter of opinion. I don't see it that way at all.
Everything is a matter of opinion and I'm no stranger to defending my views against the vocal majority. In this case, however, I don't need to. Unity is almost universally hated within the community and for good reasons.

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by MALsPa » Tue Sep 27, 2011 12:36 pm

prodigy_ wrote:Unity is almost universally hated within the community and for good reasons.
Well, at least you said "almost." :lol:

Of course, there are also good reasons why other folks like Unity. To each their own.

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by MALsPa » Tue Sep 27, 2011 1:00 pm

Ubuntu stirs up such strong emotions; so many folks at the various Linux forums continue to express their dislike, disgust, hatred, etc. for "the poop-colored distro," and for Canonical, Mark Shuttleworth, Unity, etc.. Yet so many other people continue to use and enjoy it. Must drive a lot of people crazy that so many people like Ubuntu, but it should be obvious that a lot of people think that it's a pretty good distro, and that there are reasons for that. Or maybe some folks want to believe that all Ubuntu users are just stupid or misguided or whatever.

Most folks in this community have a preference for the things Mint offers. Back when I first started using Ubuntu and Mint, even then I couldn't really find any reason to prefer one over the other when I looked at things overall (so, I kept using both). Over the years, I guess there are a few things that I like better about Ubuntu, but Mint's great, too.

Everyone's experiences are different, I guess. Some people have some very good reasons why they don't use Ubuntu; other people, I don't know, sometimes I don't understand why there's such animosity towards Ubuntu. I think I'd be able to understand it better if my experiences with the distro hadn't been so good during all this time, but Ubuntu has been fine here, so... "Why not Ubuntu?"

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by KBD47 » Tue Sep 27, 2011 6:07 pm

I still think Gnome 2 and KDE are much better on a big screen using a mouse, but the more I've seen of Gnome 3, Ubuntu may turn out to be genius' to leave that interface behind. I think Unity can be made better, and it works well enough on netbooks and small laptops. Only KDE can really fill the missing Gnome 2 niche on larger computers IMO.
KBD47

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by linuxviolin » Tue Sep 27, 2011 7:35 pm

KBD47 wrote:I still think Gnome 2 and KDE are much better on a big screen using a mouse, but the more I've seen of Gnome 3, Ubuntu may turn out to be genius' to leave that interface behind. I think Unity can be made better, and it works well enough on netbooks and small laptops. Only KDE can really fill the missing Gnome 2 niche on larger computers IMO.
+1. Agree, also about Unity which is probably better than GNOME 3. About KDE, yes, it is the only desktop currently (in a "classic" mode: folder view etc)... We'll see in the future.
K.I.S.S. ===> "Keep It Simple, Stupid"
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." (Leonardo da Vinci)
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." (Albert Einstein)

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by Robin » Tue Sep 27, 2011 8:23 pm

"Distro Drama" was one of the reasons I attempted to distro-hop last time, to SalixOS. Soooo much Ubu-hatred out there, all the "kiddie distro" remarks, bitterness against Ubuntu, Canonical, Mark Shuttleworth, and everyone who ever admitted to using and liking Ubuntu (or Kubu, Xubu, etc).

I've hopped alot and learned a little, from SalixOS most recently to Crunchbang, Debian, PCLinuxOS, Mepis, and nearly a dozen others. And y'know what, I've decided to just stop giving a damn about "distro drama" anymore. Let Linux snobs think whatever they will of me and my fellow Xubuntu lovers. It boils down to four things for me:

Stability (LTS releases), works on my hardware (only the Ubuntu-based distros and Mepis work perfectly out of the box on my hardware - none of the "pure Debian" ones not the hybrid ones like PCLinuxOS, nor the Slackware-based ones do), repositories, and community.

In all four of those areas that matter most to me, Xubu (and Mint 9 Xfce) totally kick butt, effortlessly, quickly, elegantly, simply, and beautifully. The LTS releases rock so far, all have been effortless on my hardware, repositories are unsurpassed, and the community, both here and on UF is enthusiastic, supportive, friendly, and for the most part polite.

The farther along I go, the more my computer is "just another appliance" to me, and as long as it works, I use it to get work done, not to tinker with. I got an awesome free OS that does all I need it to on this old hand-me-down machine that would have ended up in the trash if not for the amazing work Canonical has done in "taming Debian" and bringing Debian's awesomeness to "ordinary users" like me.

Distro drama? I just don't care anymore. It's all Linux, all wondrous, and I'm grateful for every expression of it, and that there's one that's perfect for me.

/rant

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by prodigy_ » Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:52 am

MALsPa wrote:Yet so many other people continue to use and enjoy it.
Define "use and enjoy". Something tells me that FF + Thunderbird + Pidgin + occasional LibreOffice "workflow" falls under this category. Naturally you don't need a customizable high productivity DE for that. Anything will suffice.
MALsPa wrote:Or maybe some folks want to believe that all Ubuntu users are just stupid or misguided or whatever.
You don't have to be stupid to be a n00b. People who think that Ubuntu in its current state (upstart, Plymouth, Unity, etc.) is a serious Linux distro are n00bs. But on a desktop you don't want serious, you want something that installs quickly and works out of the box. Pre-Unity Ubunty did just that but Unity is a deal-breaker for anyone who runs anything except the most generic apps, for anyone who needs an actual workplace.

Xfce looks promising now. But I haven't tested it enough to draw a conclusion yet.
MALsPa wrote:I don't understand why there's such animosity towards Ubuntu.
Because it's a great potential being wasted. It's a promise being turned upside down simple because of the impatience of those at the helm. But "animosity" isn't the right word. When you see something that suited its purpose nearly perfectly being turned into garbage right before your eyes, when you hear the community outcry being ignored, it's not animosity. It's disappointment and resentment.

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by prodigy_ » Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:11 am

Robin wrote:Soooo much Ubu-hatred out there, all the "kiddie distro" remarks, bitterness against Ubuntu, Canonical, Mark Shuttleworth, and everyone who ever admitted to using and liking Ubuntu (or Kubu, Xubu, etc).
This hatred comes from kids who learned how to compile Gentoo (in fact, "learned" is a loud word here, since they simply followed a step-by-step HOWTO and used genkernel script to auto-compile the kernel). They should be simply ignored.

There are reasons why some things in Ubuntu (RootSudo, upstart, etc.) are considered poor design. There are reasons why distros like RHEL and SLES exist and bring profit. There are reason why Gentoo is cool, especially if you're a developer. But Ubuntu used to be the best desktop experience. Any other major distro, including pure Debian meant a lot more pain in order to get things working. Looking at Mint I see what Ubuntu could have become and I can only /sigh.

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by MALsPa » Wed Sep 28, 2011 9:34 am

prodigy_ wrote:It's disappointment and resentment.
Oh, well. Go ahead and feel disappointed and resentful, then. I'm happy, and it feels nice! :lol:

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by MALsPa » Wed Sep 28, 2011 9:41 am

Life's too short, folks. Too much negativity and bitterness out there as it is. Use what makes you happy, try not to get too upset about things that aren't as you think they should be because there will always be things that aren't as you think they should be.

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by linuxviolin » Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:12 pm

MALsPa wrote:Life's too short, folks. Too much negativity and bitterness out there as it is. Use what makes you happy,
Something makes me happy? In the computer field? Err... :roll: :mrgreen:
K.I.S.S. ===> "Keep It Simple, Stupid"
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." (Leonardo da Vinci)
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." (Albert Einstein)

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by Robin » Wed Sep 28, 2011 4:06 pm

You're the best, MALsPa!

People can always find stuff to whine about. I guess it still surprises me that Linux users of all people - judging by the Linux forums I've found online at least - are among the whiners in such large numbers. We've got Linux! We should be the most contented of computer users, not the whiniest.

With all these distros to choose from, my goodness, it's too easy to change to something that suits us when our old standby disappoints us. I'm no Linux guru, but one thing I've learned in my two little years as a 'nix user is that it is the nature of Linux and free software to be in a state of constant flux. Change is constant, relentless, and unavoidable in Linux. It can be mitigated of course by sticking with LTS releases, Debian Stable, Old Stable, CentOS, etc. But even those are bound to change over time as support ends. That's just Linux being Linux.

Change is inevitable. Why not just enjoy the ride, and contribute to positive change if you can.

You rock, MALsPa!

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Re: Why not Ubuntu?

Post by linuxviolin » Thu Sep 29, 2011 10:03 am

Robin wrote:it is the nature of Linux and free software to be in a state of constant flux. Change is constant, relentless, and unavoidable in Linux. (...) That's just Linux being Linux.

Change is inevitable.
Well, this is precisely one of the "problems" with Linux...
K.I.S.S. ===> "Keep It Simple, Stupid"
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." (Leonardo da Vinci)
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." (Albert Einstein)

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