Debian fanaticism

Chat about Linux in general
User avatar
JOPETA
Level 15
Level 15
Posts: 5716
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:10 am
Location: En un lugar de cuyo nombre no quiero acordarme

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by JOPETA » Mon Feb 02, 2015 12:39 pm

One cold mate please.
Ni cola de león ni cabeza de ratón, prefiero ser diente de ajo.(Javier Krahe)

curtvaughan
Level 3
Level 3
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:54 pm
Location: Austin, Tx

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by curtvaughan » Mon Feb 02, 2015 5:22 pm

Hey Exploder, just ran across some of your posts in Debian land. Snark!!! Can of worms, indeed :lol:
Move from rim to hub: know the wheel.

Image

exploder
Level 15
Level 15
Posts: 5532
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2007 10:50 am
Location: HartfordCity, Indiana USA
Contact:

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by exploder » Mon Feb 02, 2015 6:36 pm

Yeah, I feel the love there.... :lol: That must be why there was a good couple of years between me joining the forum and posting anything again. You have to be careful what you ask as well as be very careful of the wording you use. That's nothing though! I asked one question about an installer on another forum (different distro) and had a developer immediately get crappy with me! It took several days for anyone to answer my question! It was even funnier when DistroWatch tried to review that distro and had the exact same problem with the installer!

My question was really simple and I asked it in a pleasant manor. I have no idea why the guy went ballistic over it. Needless to say I have never returned to that forum. I belong to a lot of forms, most communities are great but there are a few I stay away from.

User avatar
RacerBG
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 377
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2013 4:31 am
Location: Bulgaria

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by RacerBG » Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:35 am

exploder wrote:I belong to a lot of forms, most communities are great but there are a few I stay away from.
Exactly. :)
Proud of Linux Mint!

User avatar
DrHu
Level 17
Level 17
Posts: 7537
Joined: Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:20 pm

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by DrHu » Mon Feb 09, 2015 11:36 am

I am not that sure any Linux distribution can encourage windows users(or is that fanatics) to switch: just like the Apple switch campains
--it all seems such a waste of effort..

However, if computer users of any stripe would just take a step back and see that every OS available is using ideas from anywhere: there erstwhile competitors
--so exactly how much different are all these OS desktops supposed to be
  • Your favorite file manager or icons shouldn't be counting for much
    --if you find another OS is quicker, cheaper (cost-of-ownership over time) or better serves your needs, whether that is business or personal
Debian and even Fedora or possibly *BSD systems have a right to be annoyed that derivative Linux distributions use their product and don't even proffer any credit to the originators..
--someone else called it the mothership

Now, unless a Linux distribution such as Red Hat's Fedora or Ubuntu decided to go their own way completely, and not depend on some volunteer group supporting the parent distribution
--then we could say they have no allegience to the mothership
  • And as an aside, there are: unless we all did it old style/get source code, compile and fix any source/system errors, only two main (3 if you count non-linux, but compatible for linux programs *BSD systems)
    --that is RPM or APT package managers: derived from the parent distribution/supported product..
Anyway I don't find any fanatic fans of a particular system to be that much of a bother
--I just tsk tsk (and pass on) when I come across such dross: whether it is on twitter/facebook or some other hangout..

User avatar
killer de bug
Level 14
Level 14
Posts: 5415
Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 1:49 pm
Location: Leuven, Belgium

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by killer de bug » Mon Feb 09, 2015 3:42 pm

xenopeek wrote:While not wanting to invalidate anybody's personal experience, let's be careful and not judge an entire community or distro by it. Like with any group of individuals, in some communities you'll feel at home and in others you won't. But that's your personal experience. Acknowledge that you have a choice what communities to join or part, and other people will make other choices based on their preferences.
I have personally never had any problem with the Debian guys. On Forums or IRC.
They knew I was using LMDE and still they helped me.

That some of you may have encountered bad experiences may be true, but I don't think this is a 100% statement.
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.

Algus
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:24 am
Location: Arizona

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by Algus » Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:58 am

I've had good luck with the Debian mailing list, which I have followed for a couple years now. The Debian forums are kind of hohum. It has some elitists but my big problem is that it is relatively slow compared to i.e. the Ubuntu forums (great community there BTW). I'm more inclined to visit them for help with something than I am the Debian forum.

Debian itself is great though. It requires a bit more work to get going than Ubuntu or Mint but man, I feel like you can get all the perks with a tuned Debian system that you get with Ubuntu and Mint and none of the drawbacks. I had a very lean Debian build on my chromebook and it was fantastic.

curtvaughan
Level 3
Level 3
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:54 pm
Location: Austin, Tx

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by curtvaughan » Mon Feb 16, 2015 7:24 am

I want to try doing a full blown Linux install on my chromebook. With 20 GB SSD local storage, who knows? Cheap little thing works well for what it was intended (browsing), but I am curious. What are your experiences since your Debian install?
Move from rim to hub: know the wheel.

Image

Algus
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:24 am
Location: Arizona

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by Algus » Mon Feb 16, 2015 1:28 pm

curtvaughan wrote:I want to try doing a full blown Linux install on my chromebook. With 20 GB SSD local storage, who knows? Cheap little thing works well for what it was intended (browsing), but I am curious. What are your experiences since your Debian install?
I run crouton vs. a complete replacement. Especially since the latest updates and extensions so you can now run it Windowed. To me that is a much easier solution than dual booting or having to switch VTs.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2864153/ ... indow.html

You can also now use scripts to launch directly to crouton

https://github.com/dnschneid/crouton/wi ... OS-startup

Stuff is broken out of the box. Off the top of my head I know I had to google fixes for the trackpad. It was nothing major, just some edits to xorg.conf.

I've run it on an ARM Chromebook (Samsung 303) and an Intel Chromebook (1st Gen HP 14). Runs pretty good on both systems. I am an Xfce fanboy so it was me DE of choice. As far as software goes, my main use was for a better media player (Totem works great on the Intel Celeron) and office software (LibreOffice ran fine on both). Major limit of Debian is fewer packages available from the repos so you'll have to patch in repos by hand or download stuff the old fashioned way. Nonissue for me since Debian repos contain all the major software I use. If you do the crouton install you can use flags to get a stable Chrome browser included with the build, otherwise Firefox/Iceweasel runs great.

Storage is a potential deal breaker. I got Steam running on the HP 14 but didn't have enough space after that to download anything big (only a 16 GB SSD) though I have several indie games that ran fine.

I have not messed with doing a full replacement but I've recently switched to a MacBook and when I get around to it, I will probably do an Arch install on my HP 14 just for fun.

curtvaughan
Level 3
Level 3
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:54 pm
Location: Austin, Tx

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by curtvaughan » Sat Feb 21, 2015 8:54 pm

Algus, Thanks for the Chromebook tips - might make this my next project when I have some new holiday time! BTW, since I originally posted this topic I have lurked around several other forums for *BSD and Slackware. The Slackware folks can get kind of emotional about stuff like systemd - enough to where Jeremy of "llinuxquestions.org" recently cut off a 4000-reply long thread over systemd just to preserve sanity in the Slackware forum. I've found the Unix folks in the *BSD forums to be rather interesting, helpful, and informative without all of the emotional flak found in Debian/Slackware postings. That may well be because Unix has been around for 40 or so years, and the Unix gurus are a bunch of old codgers tired of bickering (they got over that some 20 years ago).

I was reluctant to post this thread several weeks ago, but I'm glad I did. The responses have been interesting and enlightening on the varied Linux user communities. The Mint folks here are really quite balanced and pragmatical in their computer usage and philosophies. Much appreciated! :D
Move from rim to hub: know the wheel.

Image

lmintnewb2

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by lmintnewb2 » Sat Apr 04, 2015 6:37 pm

Have to agree the Debian forum is flooded w azzhats, fektards and ignorant trolls. Helps to keep in mind these people really don't represent Debian itself, they just crap up it's forum. Also not like there's a shortage of other gnu/Linux forums.

So really helps also if xyz person keeps that in mind. The Debian forum has had a really bad reputation for as long as I've been addicted to gnu/nix ( every bit of which more than earned.) Actually long time users in other communities who've been using gnu/Linux for much longer periods of time than myself, informed me it's been that way forever.

Many of the aforementioned fektards, seem to have very lil respect for Debian and very lil technical knowledge for people who consider themselves tech experts, shrugs. With all the systemd controversy, no shortage of Debian forum trolls, w blatantly insulting siglines criticizing Debian and threatening to take their toys and go to some flavor of BSD. Guessing many people, including Debian would be relieved if they would.

Then they'd be somebody elses problem. Seriously doubt they ever will, will continue to whine, crap up and troll the Debian forum. Have a user acct there, even though it's several yrs old, few posts. Usually pop up there occasionally, after a short period of participation remember how sucktastic the forum is and just find another gnu/Nix community to hang out in.

Thank goodness for LMint's community, so I consider it one more thing to be grateful to open source for. Never a shortage of choices, including a diverse range of Gnu/Linux forums + communities too. :)

curtvaughan
Level 3
Level 3
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Dec 21, 2014 5:54 pm
Location: Austin, Tx

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by curtvaughan » Sat Apr 04, 2015 8:05 pm

lmintnewb2 wrote:Have to agree the Debian forum is flooded w azzhats, fektards and ignorant trolls. Helps to keep in mind these people really don't represent Debian itself, they just crap up it's forum. Also not like there's a shortage of other gnu/Linux forums.

So really helps also if xyz person keeps that in mind. The Debian forum has had a really bad reputation for as long as I've been addicted to gnu/nix ( every bit of which more than earned.) Actually long time users in other communities who've been using gnu/Linux for much longer periods of time than myself, informed me it's been that way forever.

Many of the aforementioned fektards, seem to have very lil respect for Debian and very lil technical knowledge for people who consider themselves tech experts, shrugs. With all the systemd controversy, no shortage of Debian forum trolls, w blatantly insulting siglines criticizing Debian and threatening to take their toys and go to some flavor of BSD. Guessing many people, including Debian would be relieved if they would.

Then they'd be somebody elses problem. Seriously doubt they ever will, will continue to whine, crap up and troll the Debian forum. Have a user acct there, even though it's several yrs old, few posts. Usually pop up there occasionally, after a short period of participation remember how sucktastic the forum is and just find another gnu/Nix community to hang out in.

Thank goodness for LMint's community, so I consider it one more thing to be grateful to open source for. Never a shortage of choices, including a diverse range of Gnu/Linux forums + communities too. :)
Succinct post. Since I originally posted this I have found all sorts of territorial issues among all of the Linux forums. I have become rather enamored of Debian and its downstream varieties - LMDE, SolydXK, etc. But it is a political minefield to try to get useful, or contribute useful, information to the plethora of forums supposedly existing for Debian ... support.

Onward through the Phogg! :roll:
Move from rim to hub: know the wheel.

Image

User avatar
ganamant
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 383
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:08 pm

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by ganamant » Thu Apr 09, 2015 1:26 pm

I run Debian but I'm not a member on debian forums. I lurk there from time to time, however, and their fanatism is nothing compared with that of some Mac forums I used to be a member of.

User avatar
friTTe
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 26
Joined: Thu Jun 17, 2010 8:05 pm
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by friTTe » Thu Apr 09, 2015 2:58 pm

Yeah i agree, Ubuntu forums can be that way aswell.

Arch is something you need to try out, especially when you have some fork like Antergos :)
But if you get used to it and hang in they have knowledge like whoa

User avatar
Fred Barclay
Level 12
Level 12
Posts: 4207
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:12 am
Location: Bumping around in the bush

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by Fred Barclay » Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:01 pm

I'm running Debian Sid and I'm a member of the Debian forums. :)
But you'll never hear me say anything bad about Mint...
Image
"Once you can accept the universe as matter expanding into nothing that is something, wearing stripes with plaid comes easy."
- Albert Einstein

Ark987
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 353
Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2015 4:20 am

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by Ark987 » Fri Apr 24, 2015 3:24 am

RacerBG wrote:I'm Debian user myself but I will NEVER register in their forums because of the above reasons. One thing which you can see often there is topic like "how stable is testing or sid" and they will start to attack right away: "Why would you choose testing instead of stable, we have backports, blah, blah, blah". They only care about stability, security and anti-newbie policy. The truth is however that Debian can be used by anyone and anyone can make a choice or say what he wants to say. Sadly they will never understand this. :roll:

When LMDE 2 Betsy arrives I will try it out for sure and maybe I will stay with it.
You know what amuses me? Reading about how some people think that everyone should know how use terminal, execute task by scripting, change settings by using plain text files... and then watch this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHGTs1NSB1s

User avatar
Flemur
Level 17
Level 17
Posts: 7174
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 9:41 pm
Location: Potemkin Village

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by Flemur » Fri Apr 24, 2015 10:19 am

You know what amuses me? Reading about how some people think that everyone should know how use terminal, execute task by scripting, change settings by using plain text files...

Typing really isn't very complicated. You did it to make that post.

and then watch this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHGTs1NSB1s


A worthless little video, and mis-named (Ubuntu is in the title, but not in the video).
To save others the trouble: at least 8 years ago, Linus Torvalds had trouble installing Debian on a Macbook Air(?) - he thinks - and never tried installing it again.

The Debian installer is equivalent to the installers for Ubuntu, Mint, etc.
Please edit your original post title to include [SOLVED] if/when it is solved!
Your data and OS are backed up....right?
Mint 19.1 Xfce/fluxbox
Manjaro openbox/fluxbox

Ark987
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 353
Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2015 4:20 am

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by Ark987 » Fri Apr 24, 2015 12:03 pm

Flemur wrote:You know what amuses me? Reading about how some people think that everyone should know how use terminal, execute task by scripting, change settings by using plain text files...

Typing really isn't very complicated. You did it to make that post.

and then watch this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHGTs1NSB1s


A worthless little video, and mis-named (Ubuntu is in the title, but not in the video).
To save others the trouble: at least 8 years ago, Linus Torvalds had trouble installing Debian on a Macbook Air(?) - he thinks - and never tried installing it again.

The Debian installer is equivalent to the installers for Ubuntu, Mint, etc.
Indeed typing is not complicated at all, try to explain that to a typical user, have you ever had to deal with them?

User avatar
ganamant
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 383
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:08 pm

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by ganamant » Tue Apr 28, 2015 3:41 pm

Ark987 wrote:Indeed typing is not complicated at all, try to explain that to a typical user, have you ever had to deal with them?
"Typical users" don't expect to type commands. Too complicated, that's for experts, I'm no geek, I just want to use my computer the easy way so I can get in touch with Susan. And then Mr. Typical User will click (or -- God forbid -- "touch") his way into Facebook somehow, and once there, he will type, he will type away all day long and make Susan happy. Go figure.

User avatar
JOPETA
Level 15
Level 15
Posts: 5716
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2014 6:10 am
Location: En un lugar de cuyo nombre no quiero acordarme

Re: Debian fanaticism

Post by JOPETA » Wed Apr 29, 2015 12:53 pm

Flemur wrote: To save others the trouble: at least 8 years ago, Linus Torvalds had trouble installing Debian on a Macbook Air(?) - he thinks - and never tried installing it again.

The Debian installer is equivalent to the installers for Ubuntu, Mint, etc.
I though also Ubuntu was included in Linus speach and had other intentions. Anyway, 8 years ago Debian installer was so different than Ubuntu and derivates...

Post Reply

Return to “Chat about Linux”