32 bit distros to continue

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turtlebay
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32 bit distros to continue

Post by turtlebay » Fri May 11, 2018 2:37 pm

For those worried about Mint and Ubuntu no longer releasing 32bit distros this news about MX should be a breath of fresh air.
We have no intention of stopping 32 bit MX releases in the foreseeable future.
Postby Stevo » Thu May 10, 2018 11:14 pm
Would that be a good addition to the FAQ?

Q: "Lots of other distros are dropping their 32-bit versions. What about MX?"

A: "MX has no plans to discontinue 32-bit releases for the foreseeable future."
https://forum.mxlinux.org/viewtopic.php?f=104&t=45125

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jimallyn
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by jimallyn » Fri May 11, 2018 3:03 pm

MX is a good distro, and if I had 32 bit machines I wanted to install Linux on in the future, I might very well use MX. I installed it for a friend on an older laptop that didn't seem to like recent Mint versions, and it ran just fine. I used to check into their forums nearly every day, and was impressed with the support there. Haven't been to their forums in months now, though. If you need a 32 bit distro in the future, MX would be a good one to consider.
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AZgl1500
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by AZgl1500 » Fri May 11, 2018 4:08 pm

I used to have an old GoBook military computer, 32bit

I tried a lot of distros on it, but the only one that ran "good enough" for me, was MX-17 32bit

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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by 151tom » Mon May 14, 2018 8:42 pm

jimallyn wrote:
Fri May 11, 2018 3:03 pm
MX is a good distro,
I'm using Linux MX 17.1 (64 Bit) and it is 100% flawless and works OOTB on an 8 year desktop that Linux Mint 18 was problematic as all git out on.

I highly recommend it for any desktop computer.

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Lucap
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by Lucap » Tue May 15, 2018 1:24 am

https://mxlinux.org/meltdown-spectre-news
but be advised that there have not been any upstream 32 bit patches for meltdown made available as yet. This means that 32-bit users are still vulnerable, despite what kernel upgrades they do. We will push any 32-bit fixes if they become available.​
As people seem to be ignoring Meltdown It would be nice if a xenopeek or a Mod could make a sticky to remind people that 32-bit users are still vulnerable regardless of what linux distro they use and it may never be fixed.

Otherwise i will end up looking like a thread spammer. :P

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jimallyn
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by jimallyn » Tue May 15, 2018 1:46 am

Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 1:24 am
As people seem to be ignoring Meltdown It would be nice if a xenopeek or a Mod could make a sticky to remind people that 32-bit users are still vulnerable regardless of what linux distro they use and it may never be fixed.
Lucap, that post is from January 10th. Is there still no 32 bit patches in May? Do you have any newer information on this?
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catweazel
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by catweazel » Tue May 15, 2018 2:13 am

Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 1:24 am
32-bit users are still vulnerable regardless of what linux distro they use and it may never be fixed.
https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Se ... Resolution

Currently, the KPTI patch-set is only available for 64-bit Gentoo operating systems. Some 32-bit operating systems (for example if you are using 4gb/4gb memory split) are immune because they use separate memory maps for kernel and userspace.

https://unix.stackexchange.com/question ... -of-rhel-5

Yes, there is a 32-bit Meltdown/Spectre patch in the extended support kernel for RHEL 5. AFAIK it relies on hardware support for certain features, so depending on the age of your 32-bit system it might not be effective, but it is present.

If your RHEL 5 system is registered with the subscription manager, the update should be available — see this support article for details.


https://knowledge.windriver.com/en-us/0 ... and_Pulsar

Mitigations are being developed for:

Wind River Linux LTS-17 on 32-bit Intel Architecture processors
Wind River Linux 9 on 32-bit Intel Architecture processors
Wind River Linux 8 on 32-bit Intel Architecture processors
Wind River Linux 5, 6, and 7 on 32-bit Intel Architecture Processors

The order in which these updates will be released has not been determined.


There are fixes out there for 32-bit. It just remains to be seen if Canonical implement any related patches into their 32-bit images.
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Lucap
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by Lucap » Tue May 15, 2018 3:19 am

jimallyn wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 1:46 am
Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 1:24 am
As people seem to be ignoring Meltdown It would be nice if a xenopeek or a Mod could make a sticky to remind people that 32-bit users are still vulnerable regardless of what linux distro they use and it may never be fixed.
Lucap, that post is from January 10th. Is there still no 32 bit patches in May? Do you have any newer information on this?
Impossible to answer buddy. :(

If you Google search there's is a ton of contradicting information such as the stuff catweazel posted about it being immune when apparently it's not as it's just harder to side channel 32 bit when it's in a swap state as meltdown can only read direct from memory , but who permanently uses a computer in a swapped state?

So far the patches that have been released are unproven as they are for just test patches that distro and are of no use as a base for all distro's and people have pointed out on other forums that the way the patches works it will be like trying to patch adobe flash with the constant Whack-A-Mole of the exploit being moved around the memory mapping that it's just a pointless exercise.

That's why the likes of big distro's like Canonical are saying the only safe option is to use 64 bit ( but that is all so proving to be Whack-A-Mole ) but at least the patches will come upstream and a base for all and it will be quicker to fix when necessary as the patches can be tested to work rather than guessing.
Last edited by Lucap on Tue May 15, 2018 3:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by catweazel » Tue May 15, 2018 3:20 am

Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:19 am
If you Google search there's is a ton of contradicting information such as the stuff catweazel posted about it being immune when apparently it's not
I quoted. Your response implies I claimed it. Additionally, the conditions for the immunity were expressly stated.
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Lucap
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by Lucap » Tue May 15, 2018 3:29 am

catweazel wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:20 am
Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:19 am
If you Google search there's is a ton of contradicting information such as the stuff catweazel posted about it being immune when apparently it's not
I quoted. Your response implies I claimed it. Additionally, the conditions for the immunity were expressly stated.
catweazel wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 2:13 am
There are fixes out there for 32-bit. It just remains to be seen if Canonical implement any related patches into their 32-bit images.
Not sure how best to articulate my post in regards to the links you posted that don't give the full picture and by the tone of your post it implies that there are upstream patches available when there are not ( only 64 bit ) and Canonical can not implement anything when this is about the entire 32 bit Linux system including ARM processors that are next to be dropped for the exact same reason.

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catweazel
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by catweazel » Tue May 15, 2018 3:37 am

Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:29 am
catweazel wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:20 am
...this is about the entire 32 bit Linux system including ARM processors that are next to be dropped for the exact same reason.
Apparently it's not.

"'Q: "Lots of other distros are dropping their 32-bit versions. What about MX?""
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Lucap
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by Lucap » Tue May 15, 2018 3:47 am

catweazel wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:37 am
Apparently it's not.

Linus Torvalds declares Intel fix for Meltdown/Spectre ‘COMPLETE AND UTTER GARBAGE’

https://techcrunch.com/2018/01/22/linus ... r-garbage/

The only current fixes are for 64 bit , If you disagree with upstream decisions and feel that niche bespoke distro's speak for the entire linux community then may i suggest you take it up with Linus Torvalds rather than being irresponsible and encouraging the use of a OS that has no official patches

There is nothing else to say other than use 64 bit and keep patching.

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catweazel
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by catweazel » Tue May 15, 2018 4:14 am

Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:47 am
If
That's a very big word when you add your baggage to it. Just because I quoted something it does not follow that I believe it or endorse it, so please, leave your assumptions out of my words. Thanks.
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Lucap
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by Lucap » Tue May 15, 2018 4:51 am

catweazel wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 2:13 am
There are fixes out there for 32-bit. It just remains to be seen if Canonical implement any related patches into their 32-bit images.
So you believe and endorse information by your own words but then claim you don't. :shock:

There is nothing else to say other than the official advise is to use 64 bit and keep patching but you seem to feel otherwise and wish to argue against it so i'm at a complete loss as to what else there is to say.

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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by catweazel » Tue May 15, 2018 5:05 am

Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 4:51 am
There is nothing else to say
Indeed.
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by Hoser Rob » Tue May 15, 2018 8:32 am

Lucap wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 4:51 am
catweazel wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 2:13 am
There are fixes out there for 32-bit. It just remains to be seen if Canonical implement any related patches into their 32-bit images.
So you believe and endorse information by your own words but then claim you don't. :shock:

There is nothing else to say other than the official advise is to use 64 bit and keep patching but you seem to feel otherwise and wish to argue against it so i'm at a complete loss as to what else there is to say.
You're SO out of your depth.
Last edited by Pierre on Tue May 15, 2018 8:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Do Keep it Polite - - or the Forum Admin will get involved . . .

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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by Hoser Rob » Tue May 15, 2018 8:36 am

I don't think 32 bit users should be quite so complacent. Just because 32 bit distros are continuing doesn't mean 32 bit app software is going to do so. In fact it's going to drop like flies ... open source projects tend to be chronically understaffed and if the major distros drop 32 bit how long do you think they're going to maintain their 32 bit versions?

I'd be planning to replace some hardware.

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Lucap
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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by Lucap » Tue May 15, 2018 8:58 am

Hoser Rob wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 8:32 am
You're SO out of your depth.
https://blog.ubuntu.com/2018/01/24/melt ... ed-to-know

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/Kn ... ndMeltdown
No fix is currently available for Meltdown on 32-bit x86; moving to a 64-bit kernel is the currently recommended mitigation.
No fixes are yet available for ARM platforms. Note that a relatively small number of standard ARM cores are known to be affected.

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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by mediclaser » Wed May 16, 2018 11:14 am

So, does it mean people should now treat all 32-bit systems as insecure (regardless of OS), and all Linux distros should discontinue support for it?

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Re: 32 bit distros to continue

Post by sphyrth » Wed May 16, 2018 6:25 pm

As a 32-bit user, I really want to move on... even if I can't. But distros that still support 32-bit aren't really helping. That maybe counter-intuitive, but that's just it.

If we were talking about Linux back then (the legacy hardware savior), then that's a different story. I can have my Mint 18.x Installer as the final 32-bit distro for any computer out there. But as Mint 19 comes, I'll have move on.
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