And the Most Popular Desktop is............

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AZgl1500
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And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by AZgl1500 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 5:59 pm

a good article reflecting on the success of, and the failure of Linux is the Desktop.

and the fact that none of the developers are willing to bend, and meet up with a common goal.

https://www.computerworld.com/article/3 ... ilure.html

Microsoft is mentioned quite a bit also.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by gm10 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:21 pm

Good article, I agree with everything the author wrote. It's nothing new, mind you, we've discussed this here before, most recently at length in the What sends noobs running back to Windows thread.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by lsemmens » Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:28 pm

Very interesting, and here I was thinking that the most popular desktop was made of wood.
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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by AZgl1500 » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:41 pm

gm10 wrote:
Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:21 pm
Good article, I agree with everything the author wrote. It's nothing new, mind you, we've discussed this here before, most recently at length in the What sends noobs running back to Windows thread.
I quit reading that thread after the 2nd page....
30+ years of Windows IT support is enough for me, my daughter has a Win10 laptop, and very occasionally I have to do something for her... and that is too much exposure again to Windows :P

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by trytip » Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:56 pm

the most popular desktop is the one that holds my computer monitor. :mrgreen:
Image

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by Hoser Rob » Wed Nov 14, 2018 11:35 am

Even better article IMO:

https://itvision.altervista.org/why.lin ... rrent.html

While Linux is the only desktop I use now, at this point I have adopted the old Unix mantra, ie. "everything else is worse".

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by ud6 » Sat Nov 17, 2018 6:11 am

Enjoyed both these articles. I think there is a solution to the diversity of DEs and maintaining choice, and indeed I think this is why mint has become so popular..

Mint (for newbies) is likely to be cinnamon or maybe MATE. And it operates well out of the box. Yup, we can get different DEs and indeed Manjaro seems to be gaining popularity because it's a good post-newby system. Fundamentally, when someone gets a linux system which operates as well as windows, looks as good and is straight fowards, they'll be into linux and will gradually discover the diversity of it.

For me, as the first article alluded to, it is simply that they don't pursue the desktop. If I go around work of maybe 35 people.. all degree educated and regular computer users, maybe only 5 have even heard of linux, and 3 of those because I told them. People just don't know it's out there. People know nothing about filesystems because they live in a world of FAT32 and NFTS.. they don't know anything else exists. I've never seen an advert for Linux, anywhere, ever.

If the linux community had focussed on an entry level DE and operating system (could have been mint, but maybe it's gonna be Elementary OS soon) for marketing, then I think over time they'd filter into other DEs and distros. But is there a financial impetus to promote desktop linux?? What is the benefit for developers? Software development is also another aspect. Is LibreOffice better than MS office.. personally I don't believe so.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by majpooper » Sat Nov 17, 2018 1:45 pm

Interesting articles - the comment that jumped out at me in the second article was in essences Liinux is great if . . . . " you have the right hardware, never mess with your system and use quite a limited set of software from your distro exclusively." Pretty much this is the case for those that I support so Mint definitely is a huge improvement to their personal computing/Internet experience. I really cannot comment on the experience of gamers or those who use their PCs for video editing, live streaming, PhotoShop etc.

From the security/privacy perspective - although it is true linux is pretty much free from malware and viruses and more secure than Windows, secure is a relative term but "we" (read - linux fanboys like me anyway) sometimes act and advise folks that linux is, well, secure - end of conversation. Regardless of OS there many steps everyone would be well advised to take to mitigate security/privacy vulnerabilities.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by AZgl1500 » Sun Nov 18, 2018 2:41 am

We are having a real problem here in this house.

My daughter's laptop is 1 year old this month, on Win10 natcherly.
It is now giving her grief because every couple of days it tells her it is going to reboot, and it is pissing her off. So much so, that I was shocked to hear her say:

" I just booted up into Peppermint and it can't find Office, how come? "
Well, it has been months since I installed that as a backup to the day she got pissed enough to wonder about Linux....

since then, we have changed the modem twice on our ISP..... and Peppermint was left high and dry.

add to that, the only thing she uses in Office is Word 2003 and MS Access, and of the two, Access consumes 90% of her computer time....

so duh, I have started scouring the 'net to find something that will work with it under Linux, and so far, not doing too well.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by lsemmens » Sun Nov 18, 2018 3:53 am

Your chances of finding a Access replacement, are sadly limited. You might be able to convince it run in WINE. Otherwise. depending upon what she needs Access for, she would be best migrating to SQL. None of the native database packages in Linux are up to the task unless you migrate to SQL. Then you have a steep learning curve.
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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by nakednorman » Sun Nov 18, 2018 11:17 am

I maintain a couple of MS Access databases for 'others' and I tried to find an easy way round this when I settled into Mint about a year ago.
I couldn't face the learning curve of SQL, and I couldn't justify disrupting the 'others' who were happy with Access.
Access is pretty unique and I didn't find anything to replace it, nor did I manage to get it running properly in Wine - the only thing that worked for me was running it in a windows VM. This seemed a rather silly solution when I could dual boot with Win10.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by AZgl1500 » Sun Nov 18, 2018 3:34 pm

Found out what her "real problem was",
it had to do with Windows not responding to the Mouse Wheel after an update.

I opened up a brand new LogiTech M510 mouse and let her use that.

all is well now, and as said, 95% of her computer time is spent with Access.
she is a whiz at that program, designed a lot of databases for an insurance company in Access.

so, Linux will remain available in the boot menu....
who knows, someday, she might really get pissed enough to go to Linux and restructure how she keeps her database.


... and now, back to the Main Topic.....
the worst desktop is Windows in any format.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by Portreve » Mon Nov 19, 2018 3:52 pm

One point this article actually kind of glosses over is the fact of distributions themselves. Consider this from the perspective of a "normal person" who wants to use a computer and wants to either try or to actively use GNU+Linux. Which one do you try?

In my view, whether it's "Which distro?" or "Which desktop environment?" the real question should be "How do I determine what criteria exists upon which to base my choice?" In other words, what we're really talking about here is something on a much more fundamental level than distros or DEs.
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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by Mage of Maple » Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:31 pm

nakednorman wrote:
Sun Nov 18, 2018 11:17 am
Access is pretty unique and I didn't find anything to replace it, nor did I manage to get it running properly in Wine - the only thing that worked for me was running it in a windows VM. This seemed a rather silly solution when I could dual boot with Win10.
Access 2010 is working fine for me with Crossover. It looks at the CD and "just knows what to do." Easily worth the $40. It not only installs some extra Microsoft fonts and other stuff that is helpful, when it finishes installing everything from the CD, it is smart enough to know there are newer Office service packs and it goes online and installs them automatically also. It's really awesome. It even runs Visio!

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by AZgl1500 » Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:19 pm

Mage of Maple wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:31 pm
nakednorman wrote:
Sun Nov 18, 2018 11:17 am
Access is pretty unique and I didn't find anything to replace it, nor did I manage to get it running properly in Wine - the only thing that worked for me was running it in a windows VM. This seemed a rather silly solution when I could dual boot with Win10.
Access 2010 is working fine for me with Crossover. It looks at the CD and "just knows what to do." Easily worth the $40. It not only installs some extra Microsoft fonts and other stuff that is helpful, when it finishes installing everything from the CD, it is smart enough to know there are newer Office service packs and it goes online and installs them automatically also. It's really awesome. It even runs Visio!
Image thank you for that, I will ask my daughter if that will do the trick for her.


EDIT: it created an Error Message, unable to install my Office 2003 CD,
I know the CD key is valid, have used it before.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by Mage of Maple » Fri Nov 23, 2018 2:52 pm

AZgl1500 wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:19 pm
EDIT: it created an Error Message, unable to install my Office 2003 CD,
I know the CD key is valid, have used it before.
Office 2003 can be a problem - it requires activation and Microsoft killed the activation servers for it long ago, basically pulling the rug out from under people who purchased it legitimately. They should have been sued for that. Anyway, to activate it now you have to hack it. But Office 2003 doesn't support the newer xml-based file formats that were introduced with Office 2007, so it isn't really very useful anymore...

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by AZgl1500 » Fri Nov 23, 2018 7:46 pm

Mage of Maple wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 2:52 pm
AZgl1500 wrote:
Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:19 pm
EDIT: it created an Error Message, unable to install my Office 2003 CD,
I know the CD key is valid, have used it before.
Office 2003 can be a problem - it requires activation and Microsoft killed the activation servers for it long ago, basically pulling the rug out from under people who purchased it legitimately. They should have been sued for that. Anyway, to activate it now you have to hack it. But Office 2003 doesn't support the newer xml-based file formats that were introduced with Office 2007, so it isn't really very useful anymore...
they have also screwed up activation for my bought and paid for Win7 Pro CD,
I am doubly forced to keep a full image of the hard drive that came with my Gateway Desktop....
gawd save me if the Repair partition was to ever get lost.

I keep several full images of it with Macrium Reflect, but it is wrong wrong wrong, they they have killed officially legal hard DVD install disks.

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by Mage of Maple » Fri Nov 23, 2018 10:08 pm

AZgl1500 wrote:
Fri Nov 23, 2018 7:46 pm
they have also screwed up activation for my bought and paid for Win7 Pro CD
Wow that's lame. It's BS like this that drove me away from Microsoft. Not all that long ago I was actually a huge fan...

But Windows 7 isn't end-of-life yet. If you have a key, you should be able to activate it, provided it's the right kind. (For example, if you have an OEM key, you can't use it on a virtual machine.) If it doesn't like it because it says it has already been activated, use the telephone activation - it's automated and basically you just have to punch in a lot of digits, but it should work.

That said, Windows 7 is end-of-life in just over a year and you really cannot run it on any computer exposed to the internet after that time because it will get messed up with spyware in no time. It's time to start planning the exit strategy... You can get Office 2010 Pro on ebay for about $45 dollars and that will install, activate, and update under Crossover. You can also get Windows 8.1 on ebay reasonably and install that in a VM. Windows 8.1 actually isn't all that bad - not nearly as bad as Win 10. You can install Classic Shell, Aero Glass, etc, and it is pretty much like WIndows 7, but will be supported for many years to come. Avoid Windows 10 like the plague (although that probably goes without saying.)

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Re: And the Most Popular Desktop is............

Post by AZgl1500 » Fri Nov 23, 2018 11:18 pm

Office 2010 Pro on ebay for about $45 dollars
I might do that, had not thought to look for it on eBay

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