A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

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Schultz
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Schultz »

AZgl1500 wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:53 pm
the OP is a TROLL, pure and simple.

he has NOT returned period.

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Wow, you're tough. I was going to give him at least 2 or 3 days to respond. :lol:
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by AZgl1500 »

Well,
after 1,315,453 MicroSeconds have elapsed, he is supposed to be back and replying :mrgreen: :lol:
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GS3
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by GS3 »

cliffcoggin wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:09 am
If we ignore all the exaggeration, all the hyperbole, and all the plain lies in the rant, there is still a tiny kernel of truth in what the OP says. Linux Mint is not as straightforward to install as many here like to believe, and I presume the same applies to any Linux system. It's easy to forget how many hurdles have to be jumped even before installation can start for somebody who has never done it before.
Comparisons are usually not good and it is better to talk about each thing on its own but in the case of Linux compared to Windows the comparison is not even fair because people are generally comparing Windows, which came installed on the machine when they bought it, with Linux which they have to install themselves from scratch, in many cases on a machine which has been designed to facilitate the installation of Windows and to impede the installation of anything else. So, for the comparison to even begin to be fair, we would need to buy a computer with Linux already installed and start from there.

It is like comparing a full service furniture store with Ikea. Ikea has lots of advantages but it warns you "some assembly required" and it is foolish to pretend it is not so. Those who want to pretend installing and using Linux is easier than it really is are doing Linux a disservice. Linux has many advantages but hiding the reality of the hurdles and difficulties is not helpful.

It is like comparing buying a new brand name car at the dealer with buying a boat into which you plan to install a new motor. Totally different things.

My wife and her family use LM and have no complaints and that is because I am their IT department. I install and maintain and it takes me many hours as attested by the many threads I have posted asking for help. And I have never had to ask for help in checking hashes because my level of knowledge is quite above that.

Linux, Windows, Apple, they are all very different things which serve well for different users and purposes.
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Infidelus »

I have to say that I agree 100% with the OP's post.

That said, the version of me that agrees with him existed about 20 years ago when I first tried Linux and was ranting incoherently at how awkward it was and how nothing worked properly, and everything had to be done at the terminal.

Today?

Don't agree with him at all. While I do use the terminal quite regularly, it's because I can automate much more that way. I have a script (admittedly not a particularly good script) that I use after installing Mint which sets my desktop how I want it, restores my settings, adds all the repo's I use, updates Mint and puts the software I use on.

All that and installing Mint takes me about 20 minutes now. If I did it in Windows I'd be at it for a couple of hours.

Oh, and the best thing about Linux? I don't have to use the Windows Registry, which is the most bloated steaming pile of **** going. Give me config files any day.

PS OP, I also build computers and have been doing so since the late 90s.

:)
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by antikythera »

You are no doubt aware that GTK+ has it's own tree structure based settings UI, namely dconf editor. Thankfully it is not installed by default though as an inexperienced user can do just as much damage with it as with windows registry editor. Both are steaming piles of excrement in their own way :wink:
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by detimo »

Schultz wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:00 pm
AZgl1500 wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:53 pm
the OP is a TROLL, pure and simple.

he has NOT returned period.

Total posts:
1 | Search user’s posts
(0.00% of all posts / 1.00 posts per day)
Wow, you're tough. I was going to give him at least 2 or 3 days to respond. :lol:
hold on, he is booting up windows :lol:
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Infidelus »

antikythera wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 5:56 am
You are no doubt aware that GTK+ has it's own tree structure based settings UI, namely dconf editor. Thankfully it is not installed by default though as an inexperienced user can do just as much damage with it as with windows registry editor. Both are steaming piles of excrement in their own way :wink:
I am aware of it, yes and have used it to quickly copy paths for my script :)

I still think the Windows Registry is far worse, 100 times more bloated, and much easier to wreck; that is of course unless it corrupts itself, which has been known to happen (mostly because it's so bloated) :P
detimo wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 6:40 am
hold on, he is booting up windows :lol:
:lol: :lol:
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by AZgl1500 »

detimo wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 6:40 am
Schultz wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:00 pm
AZgl1500 wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:53 pm
the OP is a TROLL, pure and simple.

he has NOT returned period.

Total posts:
1 | Search user’s posts
(0.00% of all posts / 1.00 posts per day)
Wow, you're tough. I was going to give him at least 2 or 3 days to respond. :lol:
hold on, he is booting up windows :lol:
oh my, I am still trying to pick myself up off the floor :lol: :lol: :lol:

In all Seriousness, I have a Win7 Home Premium on a 12 year old Gateway Desktop with a 1tB spinning HDD.
I had to restart it last night simply because it lost its' IP from the router, when the LTE Modem was turned off, and restarted.

what a crock that is.... even though, I have a DOS command script batch file on the Desktop, that will "Release IP Address", that damn thing refused to accept a new IP address from the LAN port.

It took well over 25 minutes, probably more, for the damn thing to shutdown, and then power back on and get everything settled down, so that I could use Firefox. :x :evil: :twisted:

The delay was so long, I was wondering if a mouse got into the mess?
ran MalwareBytes and the result was clean.... no issues.
Last edited by AZgl1500 on Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by GS3 »

AZgl1500 wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:53 pm
the OP is a TROLL, pure and simple.

he has NOT returned period.
I wish people would stop accusing posters they don't like of being trolls. I consider it a grave insult, an accusation of dishonesty and it generally turns me against the poster making the accusation. If you consider the post to be so bad then better ignore it than start a flame war with someone you don't know. Maybe he was frustrated when he posted or just in a bad mood. And being a troll pretty much requires returning so you are wrong on that count.
AZgl1500 wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:53 pm
was prepared to show how simple it was to install LM20 this morning, but why bother?
It can be very simple if you have done it a number of times and you are doing it on a machine which does not present problems but there are countless threads, some by me, asking for help installing LM. It can be very challenging.

It is plainly not true that anyone can install LM on any machine with ease. It is plainly more false than true. Most people would find it quite difficult and not worth their time.

Any nine year old French boy can show you how extremely easy it is to conduct a conversation in French. Do you think if you get up early tomorrow morning you could do the same by noon time? Or maybe you would throw your arms up in frustration and complain about how they say "pain", "vin" and "fromage" which nobody understands when they could just say "bread", "wine" and "cheese" which is so much easier and understandable and is, after all, what they really mean.

I suppose you have seen a circus troupe who do something like a guy stands on the palms of his hands riding a bicycle and the rest of the family climb on him while going around the ring. He can show you how its done in a minute. That does not mean anyone can do it that easily and much less grandma with her hip replacement.

People are different, with different abilities, capabilities and inclinations. For most beginners installing LM for the first time is definitely not easy.
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Moem »

GS3 wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:49 am
I wish people would stop accusing posters they don't like of being trolls.
I agree (both as a forum user and as a moderator). If they're right, they are only giving the troll what (s)he craves: attention. And if they're wrong, they are being very rude. In either case, it's not doing any good.
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Portreve »

GS3 wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:49 am
I wish people would stop accusing posters they don't like of being trolls. I consider it a grave insult, an accusation of dishonesty and it generally turns me against the poster making the accusation. If you consider the post to be so bad then better ignore it than start a flame war with someone you don't know. Maybe he was frustrated when he posted or just in a bad mood. And being a troll pretty much requires returning so you are wrong on that count
Oi, Mate, chill out. Here, have a mug of beer:

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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Infidelus »

Portreve wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 8:47 am
Oi, Mate, chill out. Here, have a mug of beer:

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Damn, no beer for me :(

:P
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by rene »

GS3 wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:49 am
I wish people would stop accusing posters they don't like of being trolls.
It's not so much a matter of "don't like". I'm what I would myself find to be rather non-paranoid generally yet have been here a few major releases now and have seen the pattern repeat, what with "user friendliness" rants, near-impossible practical problems and vaguely formulated supposed security breaches being posted at those times of release, by posters with 1, 2 or 3 posts to their name.

Yah. Maybe. New releases attract new posters. And/or IRC channels of l33t doofuses that take the opportunity to have a bit of fun on the Linux Mint forums. That does in fact exist.
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Rocky Bennett »

I have to say that I disagree 100% with the OP's post. I came to Linux with zero background in computers, I just got my first home PC a few years ago and before that I had never been exposed to computers at all. Saying that, I found it very easy to find a download site to download an installation file for Linux and a tool to create a bootable USB stick. Installation was simple and straight forward and there was nothing to guess at or wonder about. It just worked.

Of course there are a few statements that have been made on this thread that I do disagree with completely. For example statements made about installing Windows 10. In my experience installing Windows 10 is just as quick and easy as installing Linux. You go to the Microsoft site and download the ISO file for Windows 10, create a bootable USB stick for Windows using the same tool that you use for creating a Linux USB stick, and the installation is just as quick and easy as installing Linux. If it takes 10 to 15 minutes to install Linux onto a computer, then it takes 10 to 15 minutes to install Windows 10 on the same computer. I have never ran into a situation or a computer that it took me more than 15 minutes to install Windows 10 from plugging in the USB stick to fully installed and using a web browser or checking my email. If anybody says that it takes them more than half an hour to install Windows 10 then that person is exaggerating or is experiencing hardware issues.
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by antikythera »

Damn, no beer for me :(

:P
Wouldn't open here either. Oh well, have some lager
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by busdriver12 »

AZgl1500 wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:53 pm

the OP is a TROLL, pure and simple.
<nod>

'nuff said :)
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Portreve »

antikythera wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 9:56 am
Damn, no beer for me :(

:P
Wouldn't open here either. Oh well, have some lager
Mmmm... Corona! Now I want some Tex-Mex! :lol:
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Infidelus »

Bleugh, gassy rubbish.

Have a proper drink

:D
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by majpooper »

Moem wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 8:43 am
GS3 wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 7:49 am
I wish people would stop accusing posters they don't like of being trolls.
I agree (both as a forum user and as a moderator). If they're right, they are only giving the troll what (s)he craves: attention. And if they're wrong, they are being very rude. In either case, it's not doing any good.
"If it walks like a duck . . . . . "
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Re: A disgruntled windows user ranting on overly complicated Linux

Post by Moem »

majpooper wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 1:58 pm
Moem wrote:
Sun Jul 05, 2020 8:43 am
I agree (both as a forum user and as a moderator). If they're right, they are only giving the troll what (s)he craves: attention. And if they're wrong, they are being very rude. In either case, it's not doing any good.
"If it walks like a duck . . . . . "
... you can still refrain from feeding it bread.
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