A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

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TheOmniad-2020
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A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by TheOmniad-2020 »

Long story short, I rage-quit Windows March 2020 (see my posting history on this forum) and switched to Linux Mint. I was happy at first but as the months went by I realized 2 things:

1. It's Unix I really like, not Linux
2. I'm really, really, really not into tech!

It looks like "feature creep" is going to overtake Linux at some point in the not-too-distant future. For me, this isn't about "bloat" or "minimalism", it's that I either (A) Have zero interest in the direction certain technologies are going (B) or I have privacy or ethical issues with where technology is going. From proprietary spyware, to absolute junk like streaming entertainment, syncing across platforms (for anything other than mission-critical systems like power and communications grids) to super-creepy, human engineering stuff like "augmented reality", VR, and companies harvesting our daily habits to gather data for Turing-Testing on AI's we know nothing about, or what I see as frivolous application, like quantum-mechanics applied to making better laptop trackpads - uh, maybe put that energy into discovering how to safely dispose of all these toxic devices after they're thrown away? The bottom line is: count me out!

Take my word for it, eventually Linux distros will have to offer this stuff by default to remain relevant and competitive. Just on a basic level, I have no need for 50% of what SystemD does or for bluetooth and a bunch of other stuff. I tried Arch & BSD without success. And it's kind of ridiculous that I have to deal with installing BSD or maintaining arch just to get away from all this stuff. I've kind of narrowed my needs down to: Unix file-system (in any format), Busybox, Emacs, basic audio/video, a modern-equipped web browser and a minimal web browser, and a good package manager in case I need something.

I have a kind of autistic solution LoL which is also quite absurd, but might get the job done. I'm working on getting the Guix system and EXWM (Emacs Window Manager) installed on OpenIndiana (used to be Solaris). I would use that machine for my extremely basic, vanilla, dinosaurian computer use. I guess I'd need a good laptop to do other things like editing video, I could run Mint on that.

Right now, I'm still Linux dependent, and I'm still using Mint on a laptop. I guess I let the world pass me by, some of this stuff is probably innocent enough, although some of it is definitely not. I just don't want anything to do with it. And Linux will have to embrace it and ship with all this stuff or it will go from 2% market share to 0% real fast.

That's my story.
Last edited by LockBot on Wed Dec 28, 2022 7:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Schultz
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by Schultz »

I sympathize with you. I agree with your statement: "It looks like "feature creep" is going to overtake Linux at some point in the not-too-distant future" although I disagree with the statement "Take my word for it, eventually Linux distros will have to offer this stuff by default to remain relevant and competitive." I don't think this is true. Anyway, be prepared for some responses here accusing you of wearing a tin-foil hat.
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by karlchen »

TheOmniad-2020,
all the best to you. And do not let the door hit your back on your way out. There is no way of keeping travellers from travelling.
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Me: 15 Years On Linux.... And I'm Still Not Leaving Linux!

Post by Pjotr »

Me: 15 Years On Linux.... And I'm Still Not Leaving Linux!

..... because I like it. :mrgreen:
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by Moem »

Do as you like... safe travels, and I hope you'll find something that works for you! 👋
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Mick-Cork
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by Mick-Cork »

Why have a Tesla (or an Ioniq 5) when it's still possible to find a Morris Minor :)
Last edited by Mick-Cork on Mon May 03, 2021 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
DAMIEN1307

Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by DAMIEN1307 »

Why have a Tesla (or an Ionic 5) when it's still possible to find a Morris Minor :)
Or even a Morris Marina or a Reliant Robin...lol...lol...DAMIEN
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by Mick-Cork »

DAMIEN1307 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 5:46 pm
Why have a Tesla (or an Ionic 5) when it's still possible to find a Morris Minor :)
Or even a Morris Marina or a Reliant Robin...lol...lol...DAMIEN
Yep, them too...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8W7Mrt7Xl54

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQh56geU0X8

:)
DAMIEN1307

Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by DAMIEN1307 »

Yep, them too...
I like the second one the best...that says it all...lol...DAMIEN

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQh56geU0X8
TheOmniad-2020
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by TheOmniad-2020 »

Some of you didn't read the post before "responding" > Read The Post.

I fully own up to my low-tech, dinosaurian ways in the OP :)

I don't think I said anything negative about Linux, only the tortured shapes it's being bent into trying to keep up with the way things are going. We have PowerShell & Edge in the repos now - anyone here up for Cortana, too? What's the point of leaving if it all just spills into our yard anyway? BTW, coming soon, you can run Linux in its own emulation layer without the "app" interface to WSL, literally parallel - why not just use Windows? We all know why. I think that makes my argument for me. We wouldn't be here if we were A-okay with everything that's happening.

PS: Humor is a thing.
DAMIEN1307

Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by DAMIEN1307 »

Yep, them too...
I like the second one the best...that says it all...lol...DAMIEN

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQh56geU0X8

EDIT...I forgot all about the Peel P50...this thing is a real joke.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJfSS0ZXYdo
DAMIEN1307

Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by DAMIEN1307 »

Some of you didn't read the post before "responding" > Read The Post.
It's all good...We did read that, we are just having a little fun with it is all...lol...DAMIEN
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by TheOmniad-2020 »

DAMIEN1307 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 6:08 pm
Some of you didn't read the post before "responding" > Read The Post.
It's all good...We did read that, we are just having a little fun with it is all...lol...DAMIEN
Well, I am hilariously Luddite.
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by Moonstone Man »

DAMIEN1307 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 5:46 pm Or even a Morris Marina or a Reliant Robin...lol...lol...DAMIEN
What he really wants is a Trabant.
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by Mick-Cork »

TheOmniad-2020 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 6:04 pm Some of you didn't read the post before "responding" > Read The Post.

I fully own up to my low-tech, dinosaurian ways in the OP :)

PS: Humor is a thing.
Ditto to what Damien said above. I guess I think I'm still in control of how I want to use technology (using LM as the vehicle), so whilst it's getting increasingly difficult to manage tracking etc, we still have tools in our armoury to limit exposure.

Tech development does look increasingly threatening though, and it's areas that we can't control that I would be more concerned about. For example, the advent of the G5 infrastructure and it's ability to make mass surveillance more feasible are potentially a bigger issue in my opinion. I'm wary of the 'safe cities' push to justify an ever increasing use of camera monitoring and the collection of associated data. Facial recognition to track shopping and movement habits down to the individual etc.

I get the principle of what you're saying, but there's a balance in there.

BTW, I do like streaming entertainment. It's better than the old days when the only choice was whatever was on the TV at any given time :)
TheOmniad-2020
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by TheOmniad-2020 »

Mick-Cork wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 6:33 pm
TheOmniad-2020 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 6:04 pm Some of you didn't read the post before "responding" > Read The Post.

I fully own up to my low-tech, dinosaurian ways in the OP :)

PS: Humor is a thing.
Ditto to what Damien said above. I guess I think I'm still in control of how I want to use technology (using LM as the vehicle), so whilst it's getting increasingly difficult to manage tracking etc, we still have tools in our armoury to limit exposure.

Tech development does look increasingly threatening though, and it's areas that we can't control that I would be more concerned about. For example, the advent of the G5 infrastructure and it's ability to make mass surveillance more feasible are potentially a bigger issue in my opinion. I'm wary of the 'safe cities' push to justify an ever increasing use of camera monitoring and the collection of associated data. Facial recognition to track shopping and movement habits down to the individual etc.

I get the principle of what you're saying, but there's a balance in there.

BTW, I do like streaming entertainment. It's better than the old days when the only choice was whatever was on the TV at any given time :)
You've hit upon most of my major concerns - people are now getting habituated to voluntary fingerprinting, thumb-print ID, hey it's for your own security! But I guess every touch-screen at the check-out line has my grubby finger-prints in triplicate by now! It's inescapable.

One of the things I did over the past year was dig up every archived online Linux discussion (Usenet, BB's, mail-lists etc.) that still exists. It's exciting stuff, especially '92-'97, there was a real sense of purpose and no backing down. I'm sorry that formats like Ogg and ODT were dropped the second proprietary formats became available - you'd even be isolated in the FOSS world if you used them, now. I'd hate to see the whole thing merge with the corporate-monster after all that amazing and heroic effort, just so people can post pics of themselves with doggie-faces and have 10,000 touchpad-gestures . . . .
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by JeffF73 »

TheOmniad-2020 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 3:29 pm Long story short, I rage-quit Windows March 2020 (see my posting history on this forum) and switched to Linux Mint. I was happy at first but as the months went by I realized 2 things:

1. It's Unix I really like, not Linux
2. I'm really, really, really not into tech!
Linux is a form of Unix.
Not into Tech? Any Unix based system you will be forced to be into some sort.
Not sure where you plan to go but Good Luck.
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by JeffF73 »

Mick-Cork wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 6:33 pm
TheOmniad-2020 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 6:04 pm Some of you didn't read the post before "responding" > Read The Post.

I fully own up to my low-tech, dinosaurian ways in the OP :)

PS: Humor is a thing.
Ditto to what Damien said above. I guess I think I'm still in control of how I want to use technology (using LM as the vehicle), so whilst it's getting increasingly difficult to manage tracking etc, we still have tools in our armoury to limit exposure.

Tech development does look increasingly threatening though, and it's areas that we can't control that I would be more concerned about. For example, the advent of the G5 infrastructure and it's ability to make mass surveillance more feasible are potentially a bigger issue in my opinion. I'm wary of the 'safe cities' push to justify an ever increasing use of camera monitoring and the collection of associated data. Facial recognition to track shopping and movement habits down to the individual etc.

I get the principle of what you're saying, but there's a balance in there.

BTW, I do like streaming entertainment. It's better than the old days when the only choice was whatever was on the TV at any given time :)
I have to agree especially after reading Clem's last news update per Cloud based OS. I am not to happy about that and I will steer clear as far away from anything cloud.
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by Mick-Cork »

JeffF73 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 6:50 pm
TheOmniad-2020 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 3:29 pm Long story short, I rage-quit Windows March 2020 (see my posting history on this forum) and switched to Linux Mint. I was happy at first but as the months went by I realized 2 things:

1. It's Unix I really like, not Linux
2. I'm really, really, really not into tech!
Linux is a form of Unix.
Not into Tech? Any Unix based system you will be forced to be into some sort.
Not sure where you plan to go but Good Luck.
Somewhat ironically, there's more tech per capita on the moon, on Mars, and up in space so the options are getting smaller :)
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Re: A Year On Linux... And I'm Already Leaving Linux!

Post by motoryzen »

TheOmniad-2020 wrote: Mon May 03, 2021 3:29 pm Long story short, I rage-quit Windows March 2020 (see my posting history on this forum) and switched to Linux Mint. I was happy at first but as the months went by I realized 2 things:

1. It's Unix I really like, not Linux
2. I'm really, really, really not into tech!

It looks like "feature creep" is going to overtake Linux at some point in the not-too-distant future. For me, this isn't about "bloat" or "minimalism", it's that I either (A) Have zero interest in the direction certain technologies are going (B) or I have privacy or ethical issues with where technology is going. From proprietary spyware, to absolute junk like streaming entertainment, syncing across platforms (for anything other than mission-critical systems like power and communications grids) to super-creepy, human engineering stuff like "augmented reality", VR, and companies harvesting our daily habits to gather data for Turing-Testing on AI's we know nothing about, or what I see as frivolous application, like quantum-mechanics applied to making better laptop trackpads - uh, maybe put that energy into discovering how to safely dispose of all these toxic devices after they're thrown away? The bottom line is: count me out!

Take my word for it, eventually Linux distros will have to offer this stuff by default to remain relevant and competitive. Just on a basic level, I have no need for 50% of what SystemD does or for bluetooth and a bunch of other stuff. I tried Arch & BSD without success. And it's kind of ridiculous that I have to deal with installing BSD or maintaining arch just to get away from all this stuff. I've kind of narrowed my needs down to: Unix file-system (in any format), Busybox, Emacs, basic audio/video, a modern-equipped web browser and a minimal web browser, and a good package manager in case I need something.

I have a kind of autistic solution LoL which is also quite absurd, but might get the job done. I'm working on getting the Guix system and EXWM (Emacs Window Manager) installed on OpenIndiana (used to be Solaris). I would use that machine for my extremely basic, vanilla, dinosaurian computer use. I guess I'd need a good laptop to do other things like editing video, I could run Mint on that.

Right now, I'm still Linux dependent, and I'm still using Mint on a laptop. I guess I let the world pass me by, some of this stuff is probably innocent enough, although some of it is definitely not. I just don't want anything to do with it. And Linux will have to embrace it and ship with all this stuff or it will go from 2% market share to 0% real fast.

That's my story.
Linux will have to embrace it and ship with all this stuff . Take my word for it, eventually Linux distros will have to offer this stuff by default to remain relevant and competitive .


1. No. There are ALWAYS..be plenty of people are who in the know about these sorts of things who will want a more bare-bones privacy respecting experience. Saying otherwise sounds like basic fear mongering.

2. Maybe Canonical ( specifically Ubuntu) might be dumb enough to fold to the " convenience and features over security" crowd of idiots, but I don't see Linux Mint be it a variety of desktop options or LMDE doing that...especially any time soon. .... Sincerely...give Clem and the LM team a little by more credit than that ok. Their core values are about security and choice... not forcing anything on an end user. This has been the case for well over a decade now.

Relax man. The end of the world is not here yet xD
Last edited by motoryzen on Thu May 06, 2021 6:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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