Why do new people give up on Linux?

Chat about Linux in general
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Kadaitcha Man
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by Kadaitcha Man »

asinoro wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:22 am
2- As long you reach your system to function well, follow the mentality of Android to updates-upgrades.
Que?
... so not to have many expectations for Linux.
<blank stare>
Coming to a thread near you: Lots of bragging about my AMD 5950X. Currently delayed due to high demand.
It's pronounced kad-eye-cha, not kada-itcha.
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by asinoro »

Kadaitcha Man wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:27 am
asinoro wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:22 am
2- As long you reach your system to function well, follow the mentality of Android to updates-upgrades.
Que?
... so not to have many expectations for Linux.
<blank stare>
Is Linux=Windows?
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by AZgl1500 »

Barbados99 wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 1:25 pm
.. snip ..

............ Frankly, I figure that if folks like Windows then heck, use Windows. I'm not one of those Linux users who think we have to have a big "market share" or an OS that meets the needs of everyone. I really don't care what other people like for THEIR operating system. I like Linux. Let the Windows minions like their OS too. LOL, it's not like this is a religion or something :-)
My daughter is using Win10, I occasionally get involved with it when something goes wrong, as it did just yesterday.
All of a sudden, Win10 decides that it will NOT answer to a Ping to its' local 10.0.0.8 IP address.

huh? I fixed that a year ago, WTH is going on.

turns out, that Microsoft over-rode my NEVER UPDATE fix, and ran through a horrible mess of issues.
1. all of the Fonts shrunk so much, neither she nor I could read them....
as her major work is in Microsoft ACCESS and making cute labels as a commercial enterprise, they really screwed up the works.

2. blocking Win10 from seeing a local Ping meant that now her Smartphone picture app can no longer send pictures to her laptop, so she can edit them in her labelling program... the new update turned on all Firewalls, foreign and domestic... that just can't work with Smartphones sending pix...

well a few cross words erupted when I figured out what went wrong.
used Recovery to back out of the "latest gee whiz update" and then I deleted the Update Manager app altogether... it will never see another update, it can't the update manager is missing.

.
Linux Mint 19.3 Cinnamon
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by RollyShed »

Another Linux Mint installation out the door today. Possibly 4 this month. It isn't my fault if they find it faster and more reliable than Win$$$$.
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by TD15 »

Back from 6 months ago. I swapped windows 10 for linux, I was bombarded with multiple issues:
- Wifi not working, had to get driver.
-Poor battery life, even with nvidia optimus.
-Lack of understanding of the terminal
-Lack of MS office
So I got back to windows.
2 Days ago, I had the idea of dual booting windows and linux mint 20. After the installation completed. Same issues than last time (+windows acting dumb and not recognizing linux), but this time I was patient, one by one, I ruled out all issues and fixed massive power drain using TLP, rearranged UEFI boot to boot linux first instead of windows boot manager. Now I am getting the best of both worlds!
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by rickNS »

t42 wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:41 pm
MurphCID wrote:
Sun Oct 18, 2020 2:58 pm
This about covers it
Completely misunderstood open source ecosystem. Thankfully there is no One Single Linux OS and never will be.
T42, I couldn't agree more, both posts.

Never read any of Dedoimedo's reviews in the past, but did read...skim that linked article, my opinion of that person is; a bit of an ahrsewhipe. No, they don't get the foss mentality, speaking of "product" and "market share". I'm quite sure the creators of many distro's do not care to take over the world, or want to shake you down for your last penny. Hence the OS is free to download, Duh.

Most of the points in that article are just ridiculous, non-issue drivel. Complaining of development ?, Really. Bragging that win 10 can run xp programs, wow, like that's important.

Furthermore, after 15 years of using Linux, AND pretending to be some kind of an expert writing all those pages eh, he still hasn't been able to make Linux his daily driver. That's just sad, and speaks volumes. When I made up my mind I was sick of windows, and Bill's "product", it took way less than a year to go completely Linux. I might add, while running my own business.

Yes some people might have a nvidia problem, but they get solved, and many more people don't have problems.

Anyway in the end this fellow says QUOTE "I need Windows" TWICE...in RED. So I wouldn't put much stock into anything that fellow write in regard to Linux.
Mint 19.0 mate on 2 identical Thinkpad T420's
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by AZgl1500 »

RollyShed wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 4:50 am
Another Linux Mint installation out the door today. Possibly 4 this month. It isn't my fault if they find it faster and more reliable than Win$$$$.
I have a very dear friend who lives afar from me, she's in Albuquerque, NM and I'm a long drive away in far N.E. Oklahoma.... she called me asking if I could help her with her husband's Dell with XP on it. ( he had passed, was an engineer designing furniture using CAD. )

I thought about that a bit, and have a spare laptop ( #4 ) that is never used, 10 years old, but useable.
Put 19.3 Cinnamon on it and shipped it off to her.

You would have thought she was in Hog Heaven when it arrived.
Says it is so easy to use, never once mentioned the loss of MS Windows.
Linux Mint 19.3 Cinnamon
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by RollyShed »

AZgl1500 wrote:
Tue Oct 20, 2020 11:03 pm
Says it is so easy to use, never once mentioned the loss of MS Windows.
Did she even know it wasn't Windows? The next version always looks a bit different so.....

I "ship" with an SSD fitted so faster system (Linux), fast storage (SSD).
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by Eric23 »

I have given up on Linux several times in the past. I first tried Ubuntu back when windows vista was a thing. I saw a video showing off Compiz and I thought it looked really cool.
The novelty soon wore off when I realised that I couldn't install programs as easily, and many programs I like simply aren't available. The programs that the synaptic packet manager had on offer at the time felt like cheap copies of windows programs that often came up short on functionality. The general look and feel of the UI in many programs was also horrible. I had various programs just crash constantly, and the whole experience was tiresome. I attempted to run some windows programs using wine, but it wasn't the same. Everything didn't simply just work. You had to fight with everything to get it working. The convenience of downloading a program, running the installer and having the program work properly without a bunch of issues wasn't there yet. So after a few months I just never bothered logging into Ubuntu.

Several years go by and I had gathered a couple of crappy old windows vista laptops from family members. I didn't have any use for them because they were too slow to do any video editing or gaming. I decided to stick Mint on them. It was handy to have spare machines to do some web browsing on that felt more secure than doing the same on unsupported Vista. I played around with them as a novelty when I was bored. The faster of the laptops would take over five minutes to boot and the slower one was under 2 minutes. Clearly Linux had issues with different systems. It seems that it didn't do a good job at knowing what hardware it was running on and didn't configure itself properly. I eventually found a solution to the long boot time, but it would have been nicer if it just worked. I tried a few video editing programs again. Although the UI was still horrible, the program couldn't do half of the things I could do in windows, and the laptop was too slow to actually use it properly, it didn't crash constantly like it did before. After a month or so they got put away in a cupboard.

This brings me to today. I was holding onto windows 7 for as long as possible, but my current machine that I used for gaming and editing had a HDD failure. I contemplated getting a new pc custom built again, but I really didn't want spyware 10.
I loaded up the old laptop with Mint on it. As I sat there watching stuttering YouTube videos in 480p I wondered if Linux on my main pc would be a better experience. I replaced the dead HDD and stuck LM20 on it.

Will I give up again or will I manage to sacrifice my favourite programs and stay on Linux?

Well its been a couple of weeks without windows at all so far. I still have several programs I miss. The counterparts I have found are not great to be honest. They do the job, but I still feel like I'm missing out. The missing features, horrible UI and general feeling of compromise is still present for me. Not to mention I had to do a weeks worth of troubleshooting to get this pc to run without freezing up. (running great now btw)

I think the one thing that will make staying on Linux easier is that Steam/Proton are a thing. I can play my two favourite games on Linux. So at least all is not lost. I don't think any of these shortcomings will make me want install windows 10 in the future, but its early days.
It's like having really comfy pair of old trainers that break and you then get a pair of rock hard leather steel toecap boots that chaff to replace them. Sure they works as shoes, but you dislike using them because its painful and you can't run very well in them.

It's great that there is an option other than bending over and taking one from Microsoft. Though I can't help missing the old days of windows 7 and all the programs I collected over the years.
I guess as more people make the switch to Linux the the choice of software will only get better.
My biggest issue is video editing software. I was using Davinci Resolve on windows, but I have found nothing to equal it yet. I have looked into the Linux version of Resolve, but haven't managed to get it to work, and it seems to be missing the most common video format in the Linux version from what I can gather.
Like I said, everything seems to put up a fight in Linux.

I have defiantly noticed huge improvements since I first tried Linux 10 years ago. I just have to overcome the learning curve and live with the available software. (Its not like I could write any better software myself so expecting free software to be perfect seems unreasonable)
It's not like I need anything for work, so I will just have to put up with it, or give in to windows 10. Only time will tell if I will stay with Linux from now on.

Those are my thoughts on why I personally gave up on Linux in the past.

TLDR
Steep learning curve.
Need to tinker too much to get things working.
Programs often don't live up to expectations compared to windows counterparts.
Installing programs that aren't in the software manager is not straight forward.
Programs in the software manager are often not the newest version.

I feel more people would switch if Linux wasn't so fiddly and problems were easy to figure out without needing to hunt through 8 year old forum posts looking for solutions relating to a similar problem but on another distro that is now 6 versions out of date, only to find it didn't help.

Seeing errors like "infertile decoding of node qf9c3pf failed on sdqu9 index partition profile handler gubbins" really isn't user friendly to the average Joe like me. I can't imagine what my mum would do if she was using Linux and encountered a problem.

It might seem like I hate Linux, but I really don't. It just gets a bit frustrating dealing with change, then having to fight with cryptic error messages. I can see why people give up on it.

That's just my two penny's worth.
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olo
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by olo »

after fighting throught 3 ultrabooks to learn the basics, I was ready to try my main PC (see below).
But I am throwing in the towel now, why?
I am just not able to get the fan under control. Over 4 days I tried with everything what is on the net.
Help was near non existent and just pointed to things I done and what did not work.

If you are a basic user and just need basic programs, then Linux (mint) is OK but if your hardware is not really supported because of a wonky sound card or touch pad, where no blocker works while typing, you are out of luck.
So, It was a nice distraction to dive for several weeks into mint 20 and take a break from the outside world.
I wish I could say it was fun, but it was frustration after frustration.

It was nice meeting you all and thanks MrEen for taking me by the hand and fixing what never was fixed before, that mint 20 stays as dual boot on that pc.

I found a posting what prettymuch sums up my experience.

...and when some problem happens you always end up copy pasting hundreds of kilometers of noodles you don't even understand in Console to solve it. Also sure package managers are cool for novice users if everything works and they need to get app from there. But as soon as you have some sort of problem (again), the solutions of double clicking driver or software installer don't exist in Linux realm and you end up again copy pasting long noodles of some repositories and once I was even expected to download and compile a kernel with even more weird long noodles in the Console. Linux is great if you expect basic functionality from it and not encounter any issues and you just want something clean and free. If you do expect anything more from it, get ready for spending a lot of time in the Console. I've began with Knoppix and Slax ages ago, tried Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Debian, Mint, Manjaro and they all suffer from same exact problems. Zero standardization and tons of hours spent in Console coz of some annoying issues. Oh and when it did work on my hybrid ASUS Transformer netbook, touch experience was out of this world horrible. So, go figure. Back to Windows 10 on all my systems and it's working great. Long term reliability has certainly improved dramatically with Windows...
Testing with (Mint 20) and Garuda KDE Dr460nized right now: "2011: ASUS is proud to deliver the world's first ultrabook..." ASUS ZenBook UX31E (now quadruple boot Win 7, Win 10, LM 20,Garuda KDE Dr460nized )
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by t42 »

There are 1050 posts in this thread already where people talk about how they hate a terminal etc. It resembles a support group for the Windows dependable persons, sort of. Although that nicely balanced by many hundred of scattered on this forum comments where people talk about why they left Windows...
-=t42=-
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by MartyMint »

t42 wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:28 pm
Although that nicely balanced by many hundred of scattered on this forum comments where people talk about why they left Windows...
Very few people I've come across in the various Linux forums have actually "left Windows".

It's typically "Yeah, I have a Ryzen 9 rig with 32GB of RAM running Windows 10...but I almost never boot into it...and when I do I always tell myself how awful it is...and for good measure I punch myself in the face...".
:roll:
When they're mentioning "how fast Linux Mint is" on a 12 year old single core laptop, I just assume their "real" computer is running the latest Windows, or whatever was installed on it when they pulled it off the shelf at the store.

Just use what you're comfortable with and be sensible about security and data integrity.
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by Moem »

MartyMint wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:41 pm
Very few people I've come across in the various Linux forums have actually "left Windows".
Count me as one of those. I do not own any computers anymore that run anything other than Linux. Yes, that includes my smartphone.
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by RollyShed »

Moem wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:08 pm
MartyMint wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:41 pm
Very few people I've come across in the various Linux forums have actually "left Windows".
Count me as one of those. I do not own any computers anymore that run anything other than Linux. Yes, that includes my smartphone.
There are no Windows computers in this house. Two or three laptops lying around and three desktops, two used every day, all are using Linux Mint.
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by Minux1 »

I don't multi boot with Windows 10 ... it doesn't play well with other OSs.
Those W10 updates are like living downstream from the Hoover Dam in flood season. :shock:
Evidence: bin there dun that
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by revmacian »

Moem wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 4:08 pm
MartyMint wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 3:41 pm
Very few people I've come across in the various Linux forums have actually "left Windows".
Count me as one of those. I do not own any computers anymore that run anything other than Linux. Yes, that includes my smartphone.
Same here. I moved over to Linux in 2001 and haven't used anything else except my Google Pixel 4XL. I haven't used Windows in so long that I doubt I could function in that system any longer. My hatred for Microshaft Winblows was so deep that I had no other choice but to learn Linux.
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by MartyMint »

revmacian wrote:
Wed Oct 21, 2020 6:32 pm

Same here. I moved over to Linux in 2001...

...Microshaft Winblows...
uh-huh
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by euphorianx3 »

I've been an Linux user since 1998 (even registered, officially) - but alongside that, there's always been an Windows installation in my house as well. But I use Linux at home 90% of the time. Why? Because to me, there's advantages that Windows doesn't give me.
Linux distros treat you like a user, Windows treats you like a product.
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by rick gen »

They give up on Linux because they can't give up the applications or programs they use with Windows.

In my case I had to look for alternatives like Libre Office for MS Office, Gimp for Photoshop,
Inkscape for CorelDraw or Illustrator, and many others.

Linux is just an operating system. There would be no problem if you're just browsing the web.

I don't focus too much on why others don't use Linux or give up on it. It's a waste of time.
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Re: Why do new people give up on Linux?

Post by bob466 »

A very good question...many say "It's too hard" and for some it is because they don't want to learn. Image

However not all Forum members are overly friendly and helpful...some are just sarcastic bullies who think they can victimise other members for what ever reason. Image This would turn some back to Windoze or at least to another Forum...which is very sad and not the Linux way. Image
Linux For Ever...Windoze Never. Image
The Freedom To Choose Your Own Avatar Without Victimisation.
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