Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Chat about Linux in general

Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Yes. Hundreds of Distros, each with multiple DE's, and some flooded app categories is too overwhelming for the general public.
54
40%
No. The insane amount of choice Linux offers is not limiting its popularity.
82
60%
 
Total votes: 136

Snydar
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 7:48 pm

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by Snydar »

You don't stop the developers from developing. Actually, the opposite is what I would suggest... bring more people in, focus on a fewer number of projects with more people. Fewer projects and more people should bring out better quality... more man hours on a project should make the product better than less man hours on a project. Call me crazy, but it makes sense to me.
User avatar
monkeyboy
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 781
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:30 am

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by monkeyboy »

Snydar wrote:You don't stop the developers from developing. Actually, the opposite is what I would suggest... bring more people in, focus on a fewer number of projects with more people. Fewer projects and more people should bring out better quality... more man hours on a project should make the product better than less man hours on a project. Call me crazy, but it makes sense to me.
OK, how do you get them to focus on fewer projects? I can see certain advantages to fewer projects but I just don't see how to get it done.
If you don't like it, make something better
If you can't make something better, adapt
If you can't do either ball your panties up and cry.

Complaining is like masticating most anyone can do it.
However doing it in public is really hardcore.
User avatar
MALsPa
Level 8
Level 8
Posts: 2040
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Location: albuquerque

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by MALsPa »

Snydar wrote:Maybe I am missing the point of why choice is being defended so much.
Well, my point of view is that, when it comes to Linux, "choice" is far more important than "popularity."
Snydar
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 7:48 pm

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by Snydar »

Well, I'm getting a little bored with this topic now, lol.

I just kind of feel like Linux would be a little better with projects collaborating more... which they may actually do more collaboration than I think... I wouldn't know because I'm not a developer myself. But, it just is frustrating having so many different options of software that are 'good enough' when it seems like they could team together and make a project that is more 'perfect.'

if I felt a little more passionate about it, I would consider e-mailing some project leaders and asking what they think about this to get some insight from real developers, lol.

Less projects -> better projects -> more popularity? That was just my basic idea relating to the thread. *shrug* :lol:
User avatar
markfiend
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 310
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:56 pm
Location: Leeds, UK

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by markfiend »

Snydar wrote:This means I might need for example one music player to edit tags, another one to convert them to a different format, and a different one to burn them to a CD.

To enjoy and manage music on my Linux rig, I sometimes need 3 different programs.
I am happy that I have the choice to get the 3 applications, but I would be much happier if I had the choice to have ONE better program that could accomplish everything and allow me to be more efficient and make things easier to do.
I honestly don't understand the problem. You have a music player, you have a tag editor, you have a format converter, you have a CD burner. Why do they all need to be folded into one program? One monolithic program that tries to do everything just ends up with huge bloat and feature-creep. A piece of software should do one thing and do it well.

Otherwise before long you end up with a monstrosity like MS Office.
Omnia mutantur, nihil interit.
Snydar
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 7:48 pm

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by Snydar »

markfiend wrote: I honestly don't understand the problem. You have a music player, you have a tag editor, you have a format converter, you have a CD burner. Why do they all need to be folded into one program? One monolithic program that tries to do everything just ends up with huge bloat and feature-creep. A piece of software should do one thing and do it well.

Otherwise before long you end up with a monstrosity like MS Office.
They do not need to become huge bloat... not every component needs to load when the program loads, only the basics.

To me Linux seems to integrate with other things very well. If you want a program that can burn, the music programmer doesn't write the burning software, it goes to another applications library and basically burns using that? I'm used to having a plug-in menu with different options, if you want a feature, you can get the plug-in or just enable it. Not everything needs to load all at once, only when needed.

I'm not suggesting one program that does everything possible in the music realm. But it is expected that you could edit your tags, rip a CD, organize your music, burn a CD, convert a format to another, etc.. The average user wouldn't want to find 3 different programs to do what they want to do, they would rather have one.

Having different applications for each feature seems a little awkward. It suggests that you would need to run more programs to get things done. I would argue it would be more efficient to have them all bundled into a single application with more features. Then you don't need to search for a program for one task, search for the next, close out, open another program. It should all be there ready to be used if you need it, at the very least as an optional plug-in. I'm not suggesting adding useless features for the sake of having it. They should be quality features that people would use, and less common things could be optional. But I don't want 3 applications with different strengths and weaknesses that overlap features, some having one, some not. That is how things are in some cases.
JonM33

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by JonM33 »

markfiend wrote:I honestly don't understand the problem. You have a music player, you have a tag editor, you have a format converter, you have a CD burner. Why do they all need to be folded into one program? One monolithic program that tries to do everything just ends up with huge bloat and feature-creep. A piece of software should do one thing and do it well.

Otherwise before long you end up with a monstrosity like MS Office.
I concur. See Nero Burning ROM for Windows. No longer just a great burning program, now you are forced to buy an entire suite of garbage. It's why I stopped using the program.
Last edited by JonM33 on Fri Jul 02, 2010 10:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
MALsPa
Level 8
Level 8
Posts: 2040
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Location: albuquerque

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by MALsPa »

Snydar wrote:Having different applications for each feature seems a little awkward. It suggests that you would need to run more programs to get things done. I would argue it would be more efficient to have them all bundled into a single application with more features. Then you don't need to search for a program for one task, search for the next, close out, open another program. It should all be there ready to be used if you need it, at the very least as an optional plug-in. I'm not suggesting adding useless features for the sake of having it. They should be quality features that people would use, and less common things could be optional. But I don't want 3 applications with different strengths and weaknesses that overlap features, some having one, some not. That is how things are in some cases.
I see your point. It did bother me a bit when I first came to Linux from the Windows world, and I've notice that it bothers other Windows users as well.

With the passage of time, I guess I've grown used to it, and I don't mind having the different applications for different tasks. It seems better this way now, to me. But I can understand that others might feel differently.
User avatar
mintnoob
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 631
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:46 pm
Location: USA

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by mintnoob »

Snydar wrote:progress in Linux seems to move sideways, rather than forwards.
Perfect summary of the progress of Linux!
Chakra Linux
User avatar
markfiend
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 310
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:56 pm
Location: Leeds, UK

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by markfiend »

If you don't like it, then you could actually do something about it. Join a project, you don't need to be a developer, you could provide artwork, or translations, or documentation. Like I said before...
markfiend wrote:join the development team for the distro you think deserves to be the only one, then you can work to make it truly the "killer distro" for Linux that boosts it to 20% market share. Devs from other distros will surely flock to your flag then!

Or join the development team for the media player (or whatever app) you think is the best. You could make it so good and so popular that developers from rival projects will give up.

Or you could just sit there carping about the fact that Linux development doesn't happen the way you think it should. What's it going to be? S**t or get off the pot.
Omnia mutantur, nihil interit.
User avatar
mintnoob
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 631
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:46 pm
Location: USA

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by mintnoob »

markfiend wrote:join the development team for the distro you think deserves to be the only one
Where in the world did I ever advocate there being one distro, or for that matter, one DE, one app in a category, or one choice of anything in Linux? You do know the different between "less choice" and "one choice", right? You need to stop misconstruing what I am advocating.

You remind me of this guy:
Too Many Linux Distributions?
By J.A. Watson, 26 January, 2010

I had to deal with the "why are there so many Linux distributions? It's too confusing!" whinging again over the weekend. I've decided to succumb to the tide, and agree - there are too many distributions, and we should immediately start reducing them, to a target of ONE TRUE LINUX DISTRIBUTION. No choice, no variations, no options, one kernel, one desktop, one window manager, one set of programs, utilities and applications. Period. We can call it "Windux" (since Lindows didn't work out too well...).
People think there are too many distros and this guy does what you do by making it sound like people like me are advocating only one choice. Very ignorant.
Chakra Linux
User avatar
mintnoob
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 631
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:46 pm
Location: USA

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by mintnoob »

Good article about what I'm talking about (although this one's just about too many distros) that advocates less choice, but not "one" choice:
Too Many Linux Distros Make For Open Source Mess

Posted by Alexander Wolfe, Jul 18, 2007

Remember the 1980s worries about how the "forking" of Unix could hurt that operating system's chances for adoption? That was nothing compared to the mess we've got today with Linux, where upwards of 300 distributions vie for the attention of computer users seeking an alternative to Windows.
[snip]
The existence of some number of multiple versions of Linux makes sense, on the grounds that there are different kinds of users who need different distros? But 359?
[snip]
There's no other way to put it: Linux is a forking mess.

http://www.informationweek.com/blog/mai ... linux.html
Chakra Linux
User avatar
monkeyboy
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 781
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:30 am

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by monkeyboy »

mintnoob wrote:Good article about what I'm talking about (although this one's just about too many distros) that advocates less choice, but not "one" choice:
Too Many Linux Distros Make For Open Source Mess

Posted by Alexander Wolfe, Jul 18, 2007

Remember the 1980s worries about how the "forking" of Unix could hurt that operating system's chances for adoption? That was nothing compared to the mess we've got today with Linux, where upwards of 300 distributions vie for the attention of computer users seeking an alternative to Windows.
[snip]
The existence of some number of multiple versions of Linux makes sense, on the grounds that there are different kinds of users who need different distros? But 359?
[snip]
There's no other way to put it: Linux is a forking mess.

http://www.informationweek.com/blog/mai ... linux.html
Instead of saying something bad about Alex Wolfe or Information Week I will suggest you take a closer look at both. Enjoy
If you don't like it, make something better
If you can't make something better, adapt
If you can't do either ball your panties up and cry.

Complaining is like masticating most anyone can do it.
However doing it in public is really hardcore.
User avatar
mintnoob
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 631
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:46 pm
Location: USA

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by mintnoob »

monkeyboy wrote:Instead of saying something bad about Alex Wolfe or Information Week I will suggest you take a closer look at both. Enjoy
I wasn't ripping him or IW. I was praising his article. I was ripping that other guy, Watson.
Chakra Linux
User avatar
monkeyboy
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 781
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:30 am

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by monkeyboy »

mintnoob wrote:
monkeyboy wrote:Instead of saying something bad about Alex Wolfe or Information Week I will suggest you take a closer look at both. Enjoy
I wasn't ripping him or IW. I was praising his article. I was ripping that other guy, Watson.
I know that dude :roll:, the "I" part of my post must have slipped by you. Let me rephrase things a bit for you then. Look qt the authors track record in regards to Linux and see if consider him a fair and impartial source you want to use to support your position.
If you don't like it, make something better
If you can't make something better, adapt
If you can't do either ball your panties up and cry.

Complaining is like masticating most anyone can do it.
However doing it in public is really hardcore.
User avatar
mintnoob
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 631
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:46 pm
Location: USA

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by mintnoob »

Then shouldn't you have said "Instead of saying something [good] about..."?
Chakra Linux
User avatar
monkeyboy
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 781
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 11:30 am

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by monkeyboy »

mintnoob wrote:Then shouldn't you have said "Instead of saying something [good] about..."?
I don't care. my point remains the same. I still suggest you look at you sources of support before you use them.
If you don't like it, make something better
If you can't make something better, adapt
If you can't do either ball your panties up and cry.

Complaining is like masticating most anyone can do it.
However doing it in public is really hardcore.
User avatar
MALsPa
Level 8
Level 8
Posts: 2040
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Location: albuquerque

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by MALsPa »

If things go the way it looks like they're going, we're about to have one more choice -- a version of Mint based on Debian. Horrors.
User avatar
markfiend
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 310
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 2:56 pm
Location: Leeds, UK

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by markfiend »

mintnoob wrote:
markfiend wrote:join the development team for the distro you think deserves to be the only one
Where in the world did I ever advocate there being one distro, or for that matter, one DE, one app in a category, or one choice of anything in Linux? You do know the different between "less choice" and "one choice", right? You need to stop misconstruing what I am advocating.
I know precisely what you're advocating. I am exaggerating for rhetorical effect. :lol:

My point stands though. All you're doing is sniping about how you think Linux ought to be. princess on forums does nothing concrete to change anything.
Omnia mutantur, nihil interit.
User avatar
mintnoob
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 631
Joined: Wed Nov 04, 2009 11:46 pm
Location: USA

Re: Would Linux be more popular with LESS choice?

Post by mintnoob »

And another who sees it like I do:
‘Innovative music player’ MiniTunes released
7/05/2010
Minitunes, the new music player from the creator of desktop YouTube application MiniTube, sees it’s first official release today...
----------------------
Comments

Janvitus - "Welcome to GTK/GNOME World, a world of 321312904012348209358290385 media players."
Chakra Linux
Post Reply

Return to “Chat about Linux”