The house of cards is starting to fall.

Chat about Linux in general
User avatar
jlr1701
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 246
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2009 3:22 am
Location: Brenham, TX
Contact:

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by jlr1701 » Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:16 pm

I totally agree. I strongly favor a move to a Debian base. I'm a relatively recent convert to Linux, but I can say that IMHO the last couple of Ubuntu releases have been disasters. Very disappointed with Karmic after all the hype leading up to its release and I can't say I like Lucid much either. But I LOVE Mint!! I am extremely impressed and happy with Mint and think Clem and the rest of the Mint team have done an OUTSTANDING job improving on Ubuntu and providing a fantastic Linux distribution. I play with other distros out of curiosity, but Mint remains my primary OS! :D
Asus Sabertooth X79 mobo/i7-3930k/Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO/32GB Corsair Vengeance DDR3 RAM/Nvidia GTX670/Samsung 540GB SSD/ 2 1TB WD hard drives

User avatar
MALsPa
Level 8
Level 8
Posts: 2045
Joined: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:17 pm
Location: albuquerque

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by MALsPa » Sun Jul 25, 2010 10:46 pm

I must be the only one here who likes both Mint and Ubuntu. Great runs on my machines with Ubuntu Dapper, Kubuntu Dapper, Ubuntu Hardy, and Mint Elyssa. Recently installed Isadora and Lucid, and both look very good. I guess I'm just lucky.

tinca
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 511
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:23 am
Location: England U.K.

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by tinca » Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:38 am

MALsPa,

I also share your good fortune, as everything is just fine.

Best regards Keith
EVGA Geforce GTX 1070 FTW
Image

brainiac
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2010 6:02 am

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by brainiac » Mon Jul 26, 2010 7:28 am

It's unfortunate that many people will see this as Linux failing to court a more widespread user base. This of course is partly the result of many otherwise unaware users who do not know that Ubuntu does not equate to Linux, ie Ubuntu is NOT the only Linux distro out there. I'm hoping that manufacturers such as Dell will look to other distributions that have a more reliable base system (insofar as hardware issues are concerned).

I recently tried Ubuntu Lucid for a spin and the problems with my laptop were unacceptable. My computer overheated in just 20 minutes of use, and I found many incomplete implementations of new features (among which were the MeMenu, the other indicator applets, Ubuntu One synchronization, etc). Ran from Lucid like it was the H1N1 flu and came home to Mint again :P.

Yes, Ubuntu has opened up many users to Linux-based operating systems, but they have driven many of us away because of such gaping hardware and software issues.

I echo many of the sentiments here regarding Mint Debian. I am looking forward to a release of this, and perhaps a rolling release version of Mint :). When that happens, I really hope the "Mint is just Ubuntu with additional themes and the restricted codecs installed!!" attitude disappears completely...

Sorry, that was a long ramble.

alpha1
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 228
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2010 2:35 am

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by alpha1 » Mon Jul 26, 2010 8:35 am

This DEbian-Mint will be based on which version?
Sid?

So it'll be like Sidux then?

GhoS
Level 3
Level 3
Posts: 135
Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:41 pm

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by GhoS » Mon Jul 26, 2010 9:23 am

Its a shame that Dell isn't fully supporting Linux now. But the same thing happened with netbooks, they started out with a lot of Linux options but then MS allowed XP to be there and it because the primary OS. Dell, I believe, found it too hard to change the mentality of people wanting Windows.
The thing is most people aren't willing to give it a chance, to use it, get used to it.
I do agree that Ubuntu is one of the big reasons for this failure. They release because its due, not because its ready, so its not fully functional for everyone. They don't include mp3 functionality and other common functions out of the box so people get frustrated. They introduce new features to a LTS release which should the most stable one of all and not really have new things. They don't update apps constantly, you have to upgrade (except Firefox is finally different here), and new users are not going to want to do that.

I'm sick of hearing everything Ubuntu. Its not the alright distro. It provides a good base for Mint but even that is changing. It should focus more on being a good base and let others be the good distros, that care about quality, like Mint.

deleted

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by deleted » Mon Jul 26, 2010 9:39 am

alpha1 wrote:This DEbian-Mint will be based on which version?
Sid?

So it'll be like Sidux then?
That would be the best of both worlds;) I'm a long time sidux user (about 6 years). I went distro hopping when KDE 4 hit the repositories and landed in Mint. Before leaving sidux, I had been running on a 6 year old install, using apt-get dist-upgrade (rolling distribution) about once a week.
I didn't leave due to instability (I do run it ever so often in a vm), but more for gnome. I had grown tired of KDE 4 hiccups...

-Hinto

User avatar
OldManHook
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 501
Joined: Wed May 26, 2010 5:57 am
Location: SomeWhere In The US of A

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by OldManHook » Mon Jul 26, 2010 10:33 am

MALsPa wrote:I must be the only one here who likes both Mint and Ubuntu. Great runs on my machines with Ubuntu Dapper, Kubuntu Dapper, Ubuntu Hardy, and Mint Elyssa. Recently installed Isadora and Lucid, and both look very good. I guess I'm just lucky.
Not Lucky, From your number of posts I think you Know How to set-up and fix your system,
Don't you think For Dell It' s about New User Support, Think about The Posts on this Site--and Comments on Other Sites.Just Think about Dells Support Lines (Most of Support Staff Don't know what Ubuntu Is) Look at the questions in the new users section of this Forum.
"Be the change you want to see in the world"
Gandhi

User avatar
jlr1701
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 246
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2009 3:22 am
Location: Brenham, TX
Contact:

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by jlr1701 » Mon Jul 26, 2010 12:58 pm

OldManHook wrote:
MALsPa wrote:I must be the only one here who likes both Mint and Ubuntu. Great runs on my machines with Ubuntu Dapper, Kubuntu Dapper, Ubuntu Hardy, and Mint Elyssa. Recently installed Isadora and Lucid, and both look very good. I guess I'm just lucky.
Not Lucky, From your number of posts I think you Know How to set-up and fix your system,
Don't you think For Dell It' s about New User Support, Think about The Posts on this Site--and Comments on Other Sites.Just Think about Dells Support Lines (Most of Support Staff Don't know what Ubuntu Is) Look at the questions in the new users section of this Forum.
A couple of years ago I encountered an M$ support tech who had no idea what Java was. He insisted that I uninstall it because it might be causing the issue I was having. I did so to satisfy the idiot, but promptly reinstalled Java after I got off the phone with the guy (with my issue unresolved).

I had to replace a hard drive on a Dell system back around the same time that was still under warranty out of my own pocket because the Dell technician wouldn't accept the fact that the drive was bad and he wouldn't listen to me when I told him how I KNEW the drive was bad (bad boot sector that couldn't be written to). But I guess he was used to dealing with customers who call in to complain about their busted coffee cup holder and he couldn't handle the idea that I might actually know what I was talking about... :roll: :lol:
Asus Sabertooth X79 mobo/i7-3930k/Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO/32GB Corsair Vengeance DDR3 RAM/Nvidia GTX670/Samsung 540GB SSD/ 2 1TB WD hard drives

deleted

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by deleted » Mon Jul 26, 2010 1:19 pm

Maybe it's something to do with my generation, but I never count on support for a buying decision. My experience with hardware support from any manufacturer is, well, none. The same goes for software support. My buying decisions are solely based on 1) will it work reliably and 2) cost. I usually find (after navigating through the phone system) that both hardware and software folks say, "OK, reboot". I tell them "No" and start googling.... I don't even let the cable folks into the house to see my network.
-Hinto

User avatar
BubbaBlues
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 397
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:23 pm
Location: Oklahoma

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by BubbaBlues » Mon Jul 26, 2010 1:33 pm

You couldn't shove a Dell computer up my butt if I had room for California. Just over priced junk as far as I'm concerned. I'll take a Compaq or E Machine over a Dell any time. Or better yet build it myself.
"I sometimes wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by embeciles who really mean it."
Mark Twain

User avatar
mmesantos1
Level 8
Level 8
Posts: 2272
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:14 pm
Location: VA. USA
Contact:

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by mmesantos1 » Mon Jul 26, 2010 1:36 pm

hinto wrote:I don't even let the cable folks into the house to see my network.
-Hinto
Funny you mentioned this, it reminds me of when Verizon came to home current home to setup Fios, I basically had to help him through the whole install process and got my own Internet up and running. The only thing I needed from the installer guy was his USB pen driver to have access to the software to activate my FIOS modem. It is sad but it is the reality of things. :)
Image

deleted

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by deleted » Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:11 pm

I don't even mention Linux when I have an internet outage, either.
-Hinto

User avatar
mmesantos1
Level 8
Level 8
Posts: 2272
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:14 pm
Location: VA. USA
Contact:

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by mmesantos1 » Mon Jul 26, 2010 2:20 pm

hinto wrote:I don't even mention Linux when I have an internet outage, either.
-Hinto
Well that is smart since they would quickly tell you they do not support Linux then just as quickly tell you that you need to boot into Windows to solve the issue or tell you the issue is Linux.
Image

zerozero
Level 16
Level 16
Posts: 6506
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 2:29 pm

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by zerozero » Mon Jul 26, 2010 3:48 pm

Just to add to the discussion 1 article i found in LinuxInside about Dell's Guide to help costumers choose theirs O.S.

http://www.linuxinsider.com/rsstory/704 ... 1280172436

and Dell's page:

http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/topic ... l=en&s=dhs

With this i just want to add that all the reasons listed above against Ubuntu may be true, the lack of hardware support, the regressions from release to release, BUT probably Microsoft has something to do with it too
Image

[ bliss of ignorance ]

exploder
Level 15
Level 15
Posts: 5532
Joined: Tue Feb 13, 2007 10:50 am
Location: HartfordCity, Indiana USA
Contact:

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by exploder » Mon Jul 26, 2010 4:49 pm

zerozero, you might just be right. That second link about choosing an operating system sure does not promote Ubuntu in any way, in fact it has quite the opposite effect....

zerozero
Level 16
Level 16
Posts: 6506
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 2:29 pm

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by zerozero » Mon Jul 26, 2010 5:14 pm

it's misleading info to say the least
Image

[ bliss of ignorance ]

User avatar
mick55
Level 6
Level 6
Posts: 1491
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 2:47 am

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by mick55 » Mon Jul 26, 2010 8:15 pm

exploder wrote:That second link about choosing an operating system sure does not promote Ubuntu in any way, in fact it has quite the opposite effect....
Agreed, and this part would deter the average citizen from choosing Ubuntu.
Choose UBUNTU if:- You are interested in open source programming
It definitely makes it sound as if Ubuntu is only for programmers or Über-Geeks. :P

mick
Things are more like they are now than they ever were before.

Dwight D. Eisenhower (1890 - 1969)

randomizer
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 865
Joined: Mon May 03, 2010 7:15 am

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by randomizer » Mon Jul 26, 2010 8:55 pm

As PC Pro said quite well: "So, just to get this highly complex argument straight: you should use Windows if you’ve already used Windows or have never used Windows. And you should only think about Ubuntu if you’re an open-source programmer. Got it?"

User avatar
BubbaBlues
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 397
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 4:23 pm
Location: Oklahoma

Re: The house of cards is starting to fall.

Post by BubbaBlues » Mon Jul 26, 2010 9:37 pm

I wouldn't recommend ubuntu to a beginner either. Nothing works in it that the average beginner would be interested in. You have to jump through hoops and know where to go to get codecs and learn commands just to play an audio file or watch a video. Ubuntu is actually standing in the way
of good distros getting recognition.
"I sometimes wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by embeciles who really mean it."
Mark Twain

Post Reply

Return to “Chat about Linux”