Installation decisions [solved]

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Tim Shirey
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Installation decisions [solved]

Post by Tim Shirey »

I am very new to Linux but have some familiarity with Sun Solaris UNIX. I ordered a Linux Mint 17.3 USB drive (Cinnamon, I think) some months ago planning to run it on a 2008 64-bit laptop. Not the best strategy because I need to maintain familiarity with Windows 10. Now I want to install on an HP Multimedia 32-bit desktop Windows XP Pro (vintage about 2004) in some sort of dual-boot arrangement. The BIOS does not allow booting from a USB. The best solution would be to burn a bootable but full version on a DVD so I can run from that. Failing that, I can try to install Mint in its own partition on the hard drive. The Multimedia has both a read-only CD drive and read/write DVD drive and all sorts of other media options. It meets all the minimum requirements for Mint.

Questions: 1) can I burn a bootable full-version DVD/CD to run Mint live, either from my existing 64-bit USB drive or some other source? If so, then how? 2) Everyone I know that tried the dual-boot arrangement with a dedicated Linux partition has been very unhappy. I that the consensus?

Tim Shirey
Last edited by karlchen on Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Marked as [solved], cf. confirmation that it is here, please: https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=237205&start=20#p1329839
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jimallyn
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by jimallyn »

1) Yes. All current Mint releases have both 32 and 64 bit versions. Get it here: https://linuxmint.com/download_all.php

2) I can't imagine why anybody would be unhappy with dual booting. I have set up dual boot on dozens of computers and never had any problem with it. You could also install Windows inside Linux using VirtualBox.
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by JoeFootball »

Tim Shirey wrote:Everyone I know that tried the dual-boot arrangement with a dedicated Linux partition has been very unhappy. I that the consensus?
Assuming that you mean dual boot with Windows and Linux, no, I personally haven't found that to be the consensus. On the contrary, for those who need Windows for whatever reason, dual boot provides for the option to do so.

What were "everyone I know" so unhappy with in their experiences?

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Tim Shirey
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Tim Shirey »

I just received the Linux2DVD disk with Mint 18 MATE and I am trying to continue my project. I started the installation but did not find an option for dual boot. Is there such an option that I was too timid to find? I am trying to dual boot with Windows XP. I have defragged the hard disk and have about 40 GB available. The people I know who tried dual boot about 10 years ago had a miserable time with installation. I just checked the Boot and Installation Forum and I find 1352 posts by people having problems.
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Moem »

Tim Shirey wrote:I just checked the Boot and Installation Forum and I find 1352 posts by people having problems.
People generally do not post to tell us that it all went well and they are happy with the way it works. :-)

Is there any specific reason to keep that XP installation?
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Spearmint2 »

Tim Shirey wrote:I just received the Linux2DVD disk with Mint 18 MATE and I am trying to continue my project. I started the installation but did not find an option for dual boot. Is there such an option that I was too timid to find? I am trying to dual boot with Windows XP. I have defragged the hard disk and have about 40 GB available. The people I know who tried dual boot about 10 years ago had a miserable time with installation. I just checked the Boot and Installation Forum and I find 1352 posts by people having problems.
Is this the 64 bit one? Should use the 32 bit one probably for an XP computer. Nevertheless, you can do it manually by choosing "Do Something Else" and then assign the system to be installed to the new partition. It will after install boot both XP and Mint through GRUB bootloader.
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karlchen
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by karlchen »

Let me stress one detail which Spearmint2 mentioned: "new partition".
Defragmenting the XP paritition is fine. Having 40 GB of free contiguous disk space on the XP partition is fine, too.
But not sufficient.
You cannot install Linux Mint on free space of an XP partition (NTFS filesystem).
Unless there is enough unallocated free space on the disk you have to reduce the size of XP disk partition by roughly 30 GB. You can then use these 30 GB, point the Linux Mint installer to them and tell it to use them for Linux Mint.
Linux Mint has to be installed on a dedicated separate disk partition, which it will format with ext4.

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Here is a step by step instruction on ...
How to install Linux Mint 18.1 alongside Windows
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michael louwe
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by michael louwe »

@ Tim Shirey

Nowadays, it is quite easy for Linux users to create their own Live Linux DVD or USB-stick, as per .......
http://www.zdnet.com/article/how-to-ins ... indows-pc/
http://www.everydaylinuxuser.com/2014/0 ... gside.html

Since 2014 or Ubuntu 14.04, Linux has become quite user-friendly for computer dummies, esp for basic usage, eg web-surfing, watching Youtube videos, emailing and online shopping = no need to go to the Terminal and do Command Line Interface/CLI or DOS-Commands.

MBR/ms-dos hard-disks are limited to a maximum of 4 primary partitions. if your Win XP is already using 4 primary partitions, the "Install Linux Mint alongside Windows" will not be available. If so, Win XP partitions have to be changed(eg to extended/logical partitions) or deleted before LM 18 Mate can be installed.
....... There may be other reasons for "Install LM alongside Windows" not appearing = the LM Installer not detecting the Windows partition.
viewtopic.php?t=182590
viewtopic.php?t=186362
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Spearmint2 »

If you want to create a LIVE DVD yourself using XP, then download this CD/DVD burner program, one I used a lot when on XP.

https://cdburnerxp.se/en/home

Download the ISO file for the mint system you want, preferably a 32 bit version for an XP computer. Should check the hash to make sure you got a good download, but can skip that step and instead burn the DVD and then run the "check integrity" after booting the DVD.

Be sure to "burn as image" when using the cdburnerxp program. Burn it at half speed, just to be sure of a good burn.

You can then use your boot change option when rebooting, such as the F12 key, or you can set the boot option in your BIOS to boot first to the DVD drive. Most XP computers were already set to boot to a CD/DVD drive as the first option anyway in BIOS.

You can then run Mint Linux from the DVD, but remember, if you want to save anything it must be to the hard drive instead. If you like it, you can then also install it. Just be sure if you want to keep the windows on it, to first run GParted, shrink the windows install from the right side or back of the partition, then create a new EXT4 file format partition to install the Linux to. If you want to use suspend or hibernate, then you would need two new partitions in freed hard drive space and that's a bit more involved.
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Hoser Rob »

Tim Shirey wrote:... I ordered a Linux Mint 17.3 USB drive (Cinnamon, I think) ... Now I want to install on an HP Multimedia 32-bit desktop Windows XP Pro (vintage about 2004) in some sort of dual-boot arrangement. ...
I'm not so sure that installing the Cinnamon desktop version on a 2004 model is such a good idea. Cinnamon is a large heavy DE that's meant to be used on modern computers. And hardware that old tends to have poorer Linux video hardware support.
You absolutely need proper 3D hardware accelerated video for DEs like Cinnamon or Unity or Gnome 3.

Get a hold of the Mate or Xfce version and install that. I like Xfce myself, and it's a bit lighter than Mate, but Mate is good too. Don't install more than one DE on the same machine ... that's a good way to break your OS.
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Tim Shirey »

Thanks to all for plenty of advice.
My hardware is an HP Pavilion Multimedia machine with compatibility to many obsolete media including 3.5" floppy and both a CD read-only drive and a DVD read/write drive. I am resistant to losing that compatibility. I expect that drivers for many of the media types are not available in Windows 10 and perhaps not in Linux.

My eventual goal is
* to install Linux on a Toshiba C655 Satellite machine(i3 CPU) either as dual-boot with Windows 10 (free upgrade from Windows 7) or as single-boot
* to have Windows 10 available on on an HP 15 machine with i7 CPU
* to have my HP Pavilion Multimedia (now running XP) machine with full media compatibility function. This can boot only from Hard disk, CD, or DVD. It has FAT 32 file system for D: (recovery and installation) and 32-bit NTFS for C:

I have a 16-GB USB2 flash drive and a 1 TB USB2 external hard drive.

Did I choose the wrong place to start installing Linux Mint? Would the Toshiba be a better start?
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by gold_finger »

Tim Shirey wrote:Did I choose the wrong place to start installing Linux Mint? Would the Toshiba be a better start?
Boot XP machine with Mint Mate DVD, open the GParted program to display your hard drive partitions and follow directions in this post to make a screenshot of that and post it here for us to see. You'll find the program in Menu -> Administration -> GParted. Then do the same for the Toshiba. We'll be able to better advise after seeing those. Don't think you'll have any problem on either machine. Main question for XP machine will likely be: is there enough space available to both shrink XP (while leaving enough room for it to "breath") and also install Mint? (Note: if CPU on that machine is 32-bit and you got a 64-bit Mint DVD, that won't work.)
Tim Shirey wrote:My hardware is an HP Pavilion Multimedia machine with compatibility to many obsolete media including 3.5" floppy and both a CD read-only drive and a DVD read/write drive. I am resistant to losing that compatibility.
Shouldn't be a problem in Linux, but would suggest you dual-boot for a while to make sure you're comfortable using Mint before wiping out XP (if that is something you're considering).
Tim Shirey wrote:2) Everyone I know that tried the dual-boot arrangement with a dedicated Linux partition has been very unhappy. I that the consensus?

....

The people I know who tried dual boot about 10 years ago had a miserable time with installation.
Things have gotten considerably easier over the years. I'd guess most people start off dual-booting with Windows and have no problems doing so. That's how I started 7-8 years ago and it was painless. So painless I stopped using Windows completely within a couple of weeks.
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Tim Shirey
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Tim Shirey »

Reply delayed by logon problems. Saving screen shots does not work because I am booting from DVD.Info you asked for below, from MS Word table, 5 columns.

Toshiba Windows 10
Partition File System Label Size Used Unused Flags
/dev/sda1 ntfs System 1.46 GiB 204.50 MiB 1.27 GiB boot, diag
/dev/sda2 ntfs TI106048W0B 285.5 GiB 87.36 GiB 198.15 GiB
/dev/sda3 ntfs 826.00 MiB 478.79 GiB 347.21 MiB diag
/dev/sda4 ntfs HDDRECOVERY 10.31 GiB 9.73 GiB Hidden

HP Pavilion XP /dev/sda (111.70 GiB)
Partition File System Label Size Used Unused Flags
/dev/sda1 FAT32 HP_RECOVERY 4.2 GiB 3.45 GiB 771.45 MiB
/dev/sda2 NTFS HP_PAVILION 107.58 GiB 71.19 GiB 36.39 GiB boot
unallocated unallocated 10.34 MiB --- ---

I cleared about 45 GB of space on the XP hard disk and installed 32-bit version of Linux Mint Sarah this morning. The installation package allocated 25 GB to Linux and set up 2 new partitions: ext4 and swap. I selected to install beside the XP. I selected to encrypt my home directory and require login for boot.

Boot is for Linux only, VERY slow and GLITCHY. It will not accept my login, and I cannot recover my ability to boot XP. So, an abject failure that I may not be able to recover.

Do you have any suggestions?
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Tim Shirey »

Sorry, tables I sent were 7 columns, typo error.
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Spearmint2 »

How did you the install? With a DVD? Run "check integrity" option on the DVD, make sure it's a good burn.

Next, since this install just happened, if all is well with the DVD, then just do the install all over again, maybe it works this time.
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Tim Shirey
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Tim Shirey »

Forgot, new partitions were labeled #5 and #6.

Just got your reply. Thanks. DVD purchased from you through Amazon, so I expect "check integrity" was run when the disk was made. I will look for that option when I try the installation again. I expected a dual-boot capability from the installation disk. Should I try to delete the partitions already created and set new partitions with an old OS selector package I have?
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Spearmint2 »

an old OS selector package I have?


I wouldn't use it and have no idea, since first it's "old" and second being I have no idea what it is. I would use a recent GParted, or set the install to reformat those partitions.
DVD purchased from you through Amazon, so I expect "check integrity" was run when the disk was made.
I wouldn't count on that considering the many they burn.
Should I try to delete the partitions already created and set new partitions
Yes
I expected a dual-boot capability from the installation disk.
Me too. Maybe you missed seeing it?
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Tim Shirey
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Tim Shirey »

I found the dual-boot selection. Operator problem.When I try to reinstall, I get a message "No root file system (as supervisor). No root file system is defined. Please correct this from the partitioning menu." Should I select "New Partition Table" or "Revert"?
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Spearmint2 »

Ahh, you need to assign a "root" to your partition which is always just a forward slash, like this /

If you wanted a separate home partition instead of it being a folder in the root partition, you'd assign a second partition with /home as it's mount point. Same with creating a boot partition instead of having it in a boot folder under the root partition.
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Tim Shirey
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Re: Installation decisions

Post by Tim Shirey »

Deleted 2 partitions. Installation seems to be working.
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