[Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

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totally lost
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[Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

Running linux mint cinnamon 19.3 in a Virtual box. I just started learning this operating system and i find myself in a spot needing to burn some Blu Ray M-discs and some DVD M-discs. I have been searching around and gained more questions haha Being these are M-discs i am wanting to burn not only are they costly discs they will be getting very important data put on them and expected to be readable many years from now. I really need to minimize the trial and error here for both reasons so i thought it was best to ask first before i get started burning up expensive disc's. So to the questions.

1 What burner software would you recommend for my task?
2 I was reading about some burner software having some sort of way to check the image burned. Is this something i would need and/or offered in a linux software?
3 Is there any more information i should know before taking on such a task? Maybe settings or work flows or any info i may not know and should before i make a big mistake. Remember this data is important to me. I would really like some advice from more experienced people. If it was just a movie i would just trial and error it.
4 Is this a bad idea to take on this task in a operating system i don't know more then a week?
5 Is it a bad idea to do this with a virtual machine or any possible problems being in a virtual machine?

Just to add some details here. I have not burned any optical disc's in years and even then i only burned CDs not blu rays or DVDs. Plus the last time i did it was on windows vista with windows built in burner. If that gives you a idea of how long it has been and how little i played burning disc's.

My system is a home built AMD APU running at 3.8ghz quad core with 16GB of ram and a 1TB SSD running windows 7. I gave my virtual machine mint 19.3 8GB of ram and 2 cores. I also have the specific M-disc optical drive on its way now along with a few hundred GB's of M disc's. I have a little over 100GB of data to go on the disc's and i planned to do 1 copy on DVD and a 2nd copy on Blu ray to help future proof my data. Oh and I don't mind this job taking time. I would rather spend more time doing things right rather then hurry up and get it over with possibly making a mistake.

PS sorry if this is the wrong forum. I am a nooby but also this is a software question so i am not sure which forum is best?
Last edited by totally lost on Sun Jan 05, 2020 2:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by coffee412 »

I really do not burn cd/dvd/blueray any more. Most everything goes on a flash drive. However, I did for a long time and used K3b to do it. Ive never done a blueray though. Seems like they came in and went out fast. Personally, I would rather put the videos on a usb flash drive.

I also kinda found that these disks have a limited life span. You said for years... Well, I tend to see they get scratched and beat up a lot and just fail.

Here is a link to a howto on K3b:

https://www.debugpoint.com/2018/08/burn ... linux-k3b/

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Re: Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by kato181 »

Could also try the following..
Xfburn, MakeMKV, or Brasero
if you are running win 7 as your main O/S, then use windows software for the burning of dvd's, there are plenty of them around.

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Re: Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

coffee412 wrote:
Fri Dec 27, 2019 11:21 pm
I really do not burn cd/dvd/blueray any more. Most everything goes on a flash drive. However, I did for a long time and used K3b to do it. Ive never done a blueray though. Seems like they came in and went out fast. Personally, I would rather put the videos on a usb flash drive.

I also kinda found that these disks have a limited life span. You said for years... Well, I tend to see they get scratched and beat up a lot and just fail.

Here is a link to a howto on K3b:

https://www.debugpoint.com/2018/08/burn ... linux-k3b/

coffee
Reading this makes me realize i did not put in enough info. I have a dehumidified fire proof safe inside of another larger fire proof safe and i don't plan to handle them unless i happen to lose all my other backups. I also have a family member with the same kind of safe i plan to put one of the copies in. So that should end any scratch or beat up issues. You are right tho many of the disc's i burned back in the day got beat up and scratched when i was young dumb and didn't take care of anything. Now days i do much better and again the safe. Also at one time i used CD players that was guaranteed to never skip. Well i never had one skip being very scratched. One time i was trying to sell one of my used ones and the guys didn't believe the claim. I pulled out the worst CD i had and played it for them. They was impressed. Then i pulled out my pocket knife and cut some pretty good grooves all different directions. It still played the disc without any skips! I was shocked! But they bought that thing right then haha. Next i am not sure if you know what a M disc is but they claim 1000 year life span. IDK about 1000 years but still should be better then a regular disc. They are not ordinary disc's to be used daily. They are built specifically for archiving data. Even our US Department of Defense and US navy has tested them. Yea i have done a lot of research on M discs before spending the cash.

Now for USB flash drives i do use them and have for years. Many of them have failed on me after sitting 2 or 3 years. I would keep about 8 flash drives around all with the same data but most failed. Thats not very reliable. But i had thought USB flash drives was better then CDs burned as a data disc and why i switched to USBs in the first place. I went to mechanical hard drives and have dropped a few wrecking them completely trying to rewrite them every so often like they say you need to do. The M discs would be burned, tested and put in the safes to stay just in case i lose all of my other backups. Which i will keep as well. Well maybe not the USB flash drives they fail way to often. But all data is on at least 3 drives at a time. M disc will be my final fallback. Based on the testing done you can do some real harsh things to a M disc and still get your data. Things you can't do to a hard drive or a USB flash drive like submerge them under water then freeze them then put them in direct sunlight Or expose them to 185-degree, 85-percent humidity, full-spectrum light environment for 26 hours.

Thank you for the suggestion. I really appreciate your help. I will be checking out K3b.

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Re: Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

kato181 wrote:
Sat Dec 28, 2019 12:34 am
Could also try the following..
Xfburn, MakeMKV, or Brasero
if you are running win 7 as your main O/S, then use windows software for the burning of dvd's, there are plenty of them around.
I will check them all out. Thank you for the advice i really appreciate it. Yea i have been told to use imgburn for windows. I hope to one day rid myself from windows thus eventually needing to do the burns at one time or another on linux.

I just now seen imgburn says this on there website " If you use Wine, it should also run on Linux and other x86-based Unixes." But I don't know i want to complicate this any more then it is right now adding Wine into it.

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Re: Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by Hoser Rob »

coffee412 wrote:
Fri Dec 27, 2019 11:21 pm
... I also kinda found that these disks have a limited life span. You said for years... Well, I tend to see they get scratched and beat up a lot and just fail. ...
That's really true, most optical disks are not so good quality and c an't be expected to last for that many years. Verbatims are the best but they're still not long term forever storage.

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Re: Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by kato181 »

Yes that's true, cd/dvd's will eventually go the way the floppy disks went, and the usb will go that way also eventually. Something newer that will last the life of a person will take over..Inserted memory chips in humans!!! Scary just thinking of it. But I'll be long gone by the time that happens.

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Re: Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

I ended up using windows with imgburn. I couldn't figure out how to get the optical disk to work in my VM to do it in mint. Then today i figured out how to make the optical work in the VM machine. Go figure right?

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Re: Burning important data what software and any more advice?

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totally lost wrote:
Sun Jan 05, 2020 2:03 am
I ended up using windows with imgburn. I couldn't figure out how to get the optical disk to work in my VM to do it in mint. Then today i figured out how to make the optical work in the VM machine. Go figure right?
Thats like when ever I post my problems. Soon after posting I figure it out somehow. :)

Glad you got it figured out.
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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by Gillcar »

I just wanted to second the use of Verbatim M disks for archives.
When I switched to Linux I needed an external dvd burner and bought the Verbatim.
I use Brasero and it works very well.

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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by lsemmens »

Just a silly thought. What is SO critical that must needs be archived for so long and so critically? I still have copies of programs I wrote back in the 80s, and my only "backup" is a copy on an external HDD, Yes, I think I still have the floppies somewhere, but I will not rely on those. The External HDD gets backed up whenever it's capacity becomes superceded, but that is not often.
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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

lsemmens wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:09 am
Just a silly thought. What is SO critical that must needs be archived for so long and so critically? I still have copies of programs I wrote back in the 80s, and my only "backup" is a copy on an external HDD, Yes, I think I still have the floppies somewhere, but I will not rely on those. The External HDD gets backed up whenever it's capacity becomes superceded, but that is not often.
I am sure many want to know but are to afraid to ask. You got guts my friend :D But I will answer. My kids photos and videos. I got plenty of stuff saved on HDDs laying around and flash drives bluh bluh. I have dropped hard drives before and lost them. Infact a week after buying a new one just for my kids photos and videos i dropped it and lost it all. Lucky i was just heading to update it from my computer after sorting the new ones in so i had them all still on the computer. Then a few weeks later the HDD in my computer failed. Lucky me i put all the fresh pics on another HDD. Some of the oldest pics are now saved in about 10 different place.

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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by lsemmens »

I understand that completely. I hope you still have your kids, too. In today's society, that is not always a given. All the best with your endeavours. As long as you have several copies in several places, you should be fine.
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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

lsemmens wrote:
Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:46 pm
I understand that completely. I hope you still have your kids, too. In today's society, that is not always a given. All the best with your endeavours. As long as you have several copies in several places, you should be fine.
Ohh yea they are still here. But I cannot make them a baby again sadly. So the pics is all we have when they was young. Most of the pics of me when younger are gone and i don't want that to happen again. Many years ago i made several copies on USB flash drives and gave them to other family members. After a few years many of them had failed. I learned fast Flash drives are not the way to go. I went threw and re did the flash drives and updated them for the grandparents and great grandparents. At least now if all else fails I hope these M discs stored in a couple different safes at different family members house will insure my kids can see there photos. I wont be depending on flash drives anymore that is for sure. HDD for quick updates threw the year and M discs once a year should work.

I am glad you asked what i was saving. I hope others read this and backup there kids photos and videos to.

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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by lsemmens »

Memories are far more important than money! :D Those who have suffered losses over the years from fire, flood, or other disaster all have the same regrets. The loss of those keepsakes. I would trust that you also have a reliable off site backup, too. Our home is full of many valuable memories, none of which are backupable or replaceable (i.e. gifts from friends and family over the years) so it would be a sadness to lose them. I (personally) am bloody minded enough to know "you can't take it with you" and if I lose them, I will be devastated, but life will go on. The pictures are something you can do something about so 'tis a worthwhile cause.
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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

lsemmens wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 7:01 am
Memories are far more important than money! :D Those who have suffered losses over the years from fire, flood, or other disaster all have the same regrets. The loss of those keepsakes. I would trust that you also have a reliable off site backup, too. Our home is full of many valuable memories, none of which are backupable or replaceable (i.e. gifts from friends and family over the years) so it would be a sadness to lose them. I (personally) am bloody minded enough to know "you can't take it with you" and if I lose them, I will be devastated, but life will go on. The pictures are something you can do something about so 'tis a worthwhile cause.
No we can't take things with us but there is another part to it. Our future generations. Not only the fun stuff our kids and grand kids will like but some of it will remind them life is actually easy now days. So many young ones get this mind set there life is harder and it is not. they have it easy and they have it easy because there past family members and past generations of other people who got us here under much harsher conditions. At one time if you had something to say to someone thousands of miles away you would have to go on a trip months long threw bad weather just to tell them. Now days we just pull out our phone or jump on a computer and type it. I don't know where you are from but surely hundreds of years ago if i wanted to talk to you it wouldn't be as easy as getting on my computer and typing for a minute or 2. When you take in everything we have today and look back you quickly learn how easy we have it and how it is not that important or needed to have the latest phone. That feeling of having a hard life starts becoming less. Your car has 100,000 miles and it broke down so your life is over? Naw wagons needed repaired with a hundred miles. I hope what i mean is making sense. Sure we have normal history but it hits closer to home when it was your own family. My grandma walking 7 miles to school every day threw snow so deep they was stepping over the power lines. Now days we get 2inch of snow and a little wind school is shut down haha While smarter it is also easier. My grandma still has photos from back then. So when my kids complain it is cold and snowy i remind them of grandmas pics. which they only complained once. If they complain there tablet is not working and life is over i can hand them one of there great grandparents entertainments. (A stick and a rock) They soon figure out that tablet is meaningless to life. The feeling life is actually easy now is a great feeling and being thankful how easy it is. I guess i feel much happier this way. But you are right life will go on if things are lost. Just maybe not as well as it could of in ways we can't measure.

Yes some of these M disks will be stored off site. I think i stated that before. You mite be amazed to see the new underground safe i plan to build for things like this to. I am lucky enough to have plenty of land.

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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

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Agree with your thinking entirely. I have photos taken by my father during the War. He was lucky in that he never had to leave Australia and I have lived in the places where he was posted. (Darwin). As he died when I was only 3 they are one of the few points of contact I have with him. I am also a member of a clan that descended from 3 brothers who migrated to Australia from Scotland in the early years of settlement so am very aware of our (personal) history and what we leave for future generations.

I certainly appreciate the time spent with my kids and their kids. My lot certainly grew up learning the value of their life, and I trust that my grandchildren are all learning similar values.
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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

lsemmens wrote:
Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:09 pm
Agree with your thinking entirely. I have photos taken by my father during the War. He was lucky in that he never had to leave Australia and I have lived in the places where he was posted. (Darwin). As he died when I was only 3 they are one of the few points of contact I have with him. I am also a member of a clan that descended from 3 brothers who migrated to Australia from Scotland in the early years of settlement so am very aware of our (personal) history and what we leave for future generations.

I certainly appreciate the time spent with my kids and their kids. My lot certainly grew up learning the value of their life, and I trust that my grandchildren are all learning similar values.
Agree and totally great

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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by ThaCrip »

Just some quick tips...

on Windows... ImgBurn (i.e. https://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/imgburn.html ; NOTE: I linked to MajorGeeks instead of official ImgBurn site because this installer does not have as much crap in it as the one on the official site does and both are exactly the same version of the software. NOTE: this even allows overburning audio CD's so you can fit more than 80min onto a AUDIO CD.)

on Linux... at least as far as basic CD/DVD burning, I tend to go with 'Xfburn'. but I am not sure if this works on BluRay as I only burn CD/DVD's, never a BluRay.

I heard about those M-DISC, which are claimed to be solid, but I have just been using standard quality DVD recordable discs (i.e. Verbatim/Taiyo Yuden) and a fair amount of theses are 10-ish years old or older now and still read well. I am confident standard quality DVD media will hold up 20-30+ years and that's still plenty of time and not only that, in 20 years time from now, even if the discs are rock solid, I wonder if it will be more difficult to find CD/DVD readers as I suspect in 10 years from now they won't be too difficult to find but in 20+ years, who knows. but off the top of my head, if I recall correctly, BluRay recordable media is more fragile than CD/DVD in general. but lets just assume those M-DISC are solid, I would probably only suggest using them for a small-to-moderate amount of higher importance data backup as I figure using a more basic setup with say two different hard drives and some quality recordable DVD etc should help minimize your chances of data loss and using hard drives is a lot more convenient. about the only thing I burn to DVD anymore is family photos/videos as just about everything else I just use a basic two hard drive setup (one copy of my data on one hard drive and another copy on another) as this does not take much effort but gives one reasonable protection against data loss, especially if the data is not of critical importance.

NOTE: ImgBurn runs on Linux through Wine, but you need to use WinXP compatibility mode when running ImgBurn through Wine.
Last edited by ThaCrip on Sat Jan 11, 2020 7:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: [Solved] Burning important data what software and any more advice?

Post by totally lost »

ThaCrip wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:41 pm
Just some quick tips...

on Windows... ImgBurn (i.e. https://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/imgburn.html ; NOTE: I linked to MajorGeeks instead of official ImgBurn site because this installer does not have as much crap in it as the one on the official site does and both are exactly the same version of the software)

on Linux... at least as far as basic CD/DVD burning, I tend to go with 'Xfburn'. but I am not sure if this works on BluRay as I only burn CD/DVD's, never a BluRay.

I heard about those M-DISC, which are claimed to be solid, but I have just been using standard quality DVD recordable discs (i.e. Verbatim/Taiyo Yuden) and a fair amount of theses are 10-ish years old or older now and still read well. I am confident standard quality DVD media will hold up 20-30+ years and that's still plenty of time and not only that, in 20 years time from now, even if the discs are rock solid, I wonder if it will be more difficult to find CD/DVD readers as I suspect in 10 years from now they won't be too difficult to find but in 20+ years, who knows. but off the top of my head, if I recall correctly, BluRay recordable media is more fragile than CD/DVD in general. but lets just assume those M-DISC are solid, I would probably only suggest using them for a small-to-moderate amount of higher importance data backup as I figure using a more basic setup with say two different hard drives and some quality recordable DVD etc should help minimize your chances of data loss and using hard drives is a lot more convenient. about the only thing I burn to DVD anymore is family photos/videos as just about everything else I just use a basic two hard drive setup (one copy of my data on one hard drive and another copy on another) as this does not take much effort but gives one reasonable protection against data loss, especially if the data is not of critical importance.

NOTE: ImgBurn runs on Linux through Wine, but you need to use WinXP compatibility mode when running ImgBurn through Wine.
Well i did try to use windows inbult burner for one M disc Blu ray and it ruined the disc. So i got to do some non scientific experiments on it. I tried dragging it on my shirt, my work coat which is that rough metetherial as i work outside in the winter, wood, some smoothish aluminium and non of that scratched it like a normal DVD or Blu ray would have. I have good pressure. I threw it around the house to letting it hit random things. It came out with zero scratches or breaks! I am impressed! It does see better built. Finally i tried bending it and it was almost a complete circle before it finally snapped. Non of that is why i wanted them tho it was more the fact the data goes on a rock like surface where normal discs is ink. Ink gets ruined in the sun, heat and moisture. But i think with my bad testing they seem tougher then normal discs. Al tho I do believe normal discs will handle a number of years as i have some from a long time ago still working fine. Scratched and all.

I did do a copy on DVD and a copy on Blu ray. Then i am covered both ways. Far as being gone in 20 years idk. You can still buy the super old tape style data readers from before i was born. In fact you can still get VHS tape players Atrack tape players and so on. Sure they are harder to find but still there. Even record players are coming back. Either way if something new comes out i will jump on that one to with yet another copy. They are not my only copy either. The HDDs will be more up to date provided i never kill all of them at once.

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