Can I still use 17.3?

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Vilsen
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Can I still use 17.3?

Post by Vilsen »

Yes , I wonder : can I still use Linux MINT MATE 17.3 ?

There are som "items " in the update-list that never have been done
but it is working just fine and I have no problem whatsoever
to use it in my daily work.

Why should I even consider to struggle with newer versions ?
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by rene »

A usual answer is going to be lack of security updates and/or other bugfixes. Usually you don't in fact need to be overly concerned with that, but if you would be install e.g. Firefox and Thunderbird directly from Mozilla and keep them updated that way. Whether or not that suffices is to your use specific but if it does, sure, go right ahead.
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Kadaitcha Man
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by Kadaitcha Man »

Vilsen wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:06 am
Yes , I wonder : can I still use Linux MINT MATE 17.3 ?
If it's working, sure, but don't expect to be able to get updates or add other software because the repositories have been torn down; only manually installed software will be available. You just have to assess the risk of using an old, out-dated kernel and attendant OS support modules.
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by Pjotr »

Be sensible and do not continue to use an operating system when connected to the internet with known, unpatched security holes all over, that will never be repaired. It's very risky and therefore highly inadvisable.

So the answer to your question is: NO. Not if you have the slightest degree of common sense.
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by rene »

Sssh. Nobody tell Pjotr that some of his modem, router and/or other devices are likely still running a 10-year old Linux install with 2.6 kernel and vulnerable userspace.
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by Pjotr »

rene wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:34 am
Sssh. Nobody tell Pjotr that some of his modem, router and/or other devices are likely still running a 10-year old Linux install with 2.6 kernel and vulnerable userspace.
1. Comparing the risks for a desktop operating system to the risks for an embedded firmware OS for routers and such, is comparing apples to oranges. Makes no sense at all. The attack surface on a desktop OS is infinitely bigger.

2. My router is running on a recent edition of FreshTomato. :mrgreen:
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by Koning Mint »

Vilsen wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:06 am
Yes , I wonder : can I still use Linux MINT MATE 17.3 ?

There are som "items " in the update-list that never have been done
but it is working just fine and I have no problem whatsoever
to use it in my daily work.

Why should I even consider to struggle with newer versions ?

You are running an OS that has reached EOL on april, 2019.
You should upgrade to 19.3 > https://www.linuxmint.com/download.php
or migrate to ubuntu 20.04 > https://ubuntu.com/

I recommend a fresh installation. Backup your important data first.
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Moem
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by Moem »

Sure you can still use 17.3. Just like you can still use Windows XP. :roll:
Just keep it off the Internet and it's fine!
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by rene »

Pjotr wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:37 am
The attack surface on a desktop OS is infinitely bigger.
No it is not and is in fact usually very much the other way around for desktop Linux installs without listening servers. As said therefore, whether or not and to what degree installing e.g. Firefox and Thunderbird directly from Mozilla rather than the repositories equalizes attack surface between 17.3 and e.g. 19.3 depends on poster's usage --- but would normally be to very large degree.

You still have this "spooky view" of computer-security where the Big Bad internet jumps up at you from behind the bushes to eat your data alive. I'm afraid it's all much more boring than that...
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by GS3 »

I have suffered much more damage and problems from updates that broke things than from malware. I am still responsible for about a dozen computers running Win XP and in the last few years have had to update a few things just to keep some things working but, on the whole, they work and require close to no maintenance. Never had any malware problems. IMHO antivirus software is the worst malware of all.

I still use XP to browse, email, etc. When I get a page that will not work in the old Firefox then I go to my Linux box but, on the whole, I can still do most things in Win XP.

I am running Linux Mint 18 on about half dozen computers and my intention was to keep them all like that until 18 reached EOL. Having all computers on the same OS version facilitates maintenance a lot.

I thought I would experiment and test LM19 and run LM18 and LM19 on the same computer and had some problems with that and so I am now mainly running LM 19 on my primary computer while keeping the rest on LM18 for now.

My policy is to have good backups of all data. Data can be lost for many reasons. I have never lost data to any malware but I have had a few hardware failures, including disk failures. Good backups are my solution to data loss prevention and it has served me well for the last three decades. Never really lost anything.

I would have no problem running LM17 forever if I did not feel the need to upgrade for some reason. That's just me. YMMV.
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rene
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by rene »

GS3 wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:55 am
I still use XP to browse, email, etc.
Ah yes, you were the guy still using Outlook Express, right? I came across a YouTube video a few days ago listing legacy computing systems and saw OE flash across the screen. Thought about you/that person...
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Re: Can I still use 17.3 ????

Post by trytip »

Moem wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:41 am
Sure you can still use 17.3. Just like you can still use Windows XP. :roll:
Just keep it off the Internet and it's fine!
let the man use 17.3 if it still boots.

@Vilsen you need to upgrade whatever it is that's available and keep an updated browser.
like saying can i still drive a Ford Model-T ? if it starts and runs why can't you use it? sure you won't probably get to ride it on a freeway at 70 miles an hour but it'll take you to the store and back

people believe a fiery demon from hell will surge out of their internet lines choke them to death and enslave their family. of course don't do multi-million dollar deals on an outdated OS, but i wouldn't be afraid to order from amazon with 17.3

in fact i still have my mint mate 17.3 tucked away i'll have to plug it in one of these days
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Re: Can I still use 17.3?

Post by karlchen »

About going on using Mint 17.3, after it has passed the end of its supported life by more than a year:

Just because you can get away with travelling the world wide web using an outdated, unsupported operating system with outdated and unsupported software, does not mean that you will get away with doing so.

I would not do so. As simple as that.

You can get away with driving a car with worn down brakes, without having an accident. But there is no warranty that you will.
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Re: Can I still use 17.3?

Post by trytip »

the answer is of course you should not go online with an EOL system. this is why i don't customize my mint any longer more than the basics since one day this too will die.

@Vilsen i guess you have to get a new linux because everyone says so, who am i to argue with them.
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Re: Can I still use 17.3?

Post by GS3 »

Vilsen wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:06 am
Yes , I wonder : can I still use Linux MINT MATE 17.3 ?

There are som "items " in the update-list that never have been done but it is working just fine and I have no problem whatsoever to use it in my daily work.

Why should I even consider to struggle with newer versions ?
The answer is that only you can say what the right answer is. If it is working for you and you really do not feel like going through the trouble of upgrading and updating (and, believe me, I understand that feeling very well), and you have good backups of all your important data, then staying as you are may not be a bad decision.

Some people enjoy updating and keeping everything up to date. Others hate it and just want things to work. Some people enjoy cooking and enjoy spending hours in the kitchen. Others just want lunch. Some people like to have the latest car and enjoy trying new cars. Others feel comfortable with their old trusted and well known clunker and would not want to change. Yes, seat belts are a good thing, nobody would say otherwise, but driving without a seat belt is not going to kill you instantly. Anti-lock brakes could save your life but many people make the choice of going without because they have other, higher priorities. Many people are going out with their friends these days in spite of the risk of getting a virus. To me, personally, it makes no sense but for them, obviously, it is a risk they are willing to take. They are not me and they have different priorities than I do.

Be aware that the people helping in this forum and offering to help (which is much appreciated) skew heavily towards the tinkering experimenting type. Of course they are going to tell you to upgrade. but...

There are millions and millions of us still using Win XP (probably more than Linux) and, I, for one, have never suffered any malware. Anti-malware software gave me a lot of trouble and I have always gone without it. MS did not develop later Windows versions because XP needed fixing, they did it because they needed to keep making money. To that end it was important to convince users that they needed to switch for their own safety.

My outdated version of Firefox on Win XP does 99.56% of what I need. If I get to a page where the video doesn't work then most of the time I just move on because I am not that interested. If I absolutely must see it then I come to my LM box.

I am/was running LM18 on all my computers but I wanted to try LM19 so I installed it on a separate drive. That screwed up the boot process and I had to spend time fixing it. Then I found out that LM19 introduces problems I did not have with 18 like the HDD grinding a lot or the USB Android connection freezing and the audio is off. In my experience every update is risky and can well introduce new problems. My old existing system might not be the best but I know it well, I know the workarounds and I can get things done with minimal effort.

Many people upgrade without problem. Then you have others like viewtopic.php?f=90&t=319127. I seem to very often fall into the second group. Even things which I have done several times give me a lot of trouble repeatedly like getting Samba to work or the Chinese keyboard. Maybe you get lucky and they work at once. More likely you will spend some time tinkering. How much do you enjoy this kind of tinkering?

I have installed LM19 in some computers recently. It has taken me a lot of effort and time and I do not regret it but I do not enjoy it either. i understand why some people would absolutely hate it. My wife and her family are some of those so they have appointed me Great Maintainer of the Systems and I have no choice but to do my duty as best I can.

No matter how easy it is supposed to be before you start, everything takes much longer that you could even imagine it could take. Updates, upgrades and "improvements" have given me much more trouble and work than any malware or outdated software.

Each person is different and has different priorities. Only you can answer the question. If updating is something you don't enjoy doing, if you have any important data well backed up, if you do not feel any need to upgrade and you wold rather spend your time doing something else, then IMHO you can stay with LM17. If it ain't broke for you then there is no need to fix it.

Just my opinion. YMMV.
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Re: Can I still use 17.3?

Post by pbear »

Vilsen wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:06 am
Yes , I wonder : can I still use Linux MINT MATE 17.3 ?
What's the point of the question? You know it's contrary to guidelines. You have the power to do it anyway. On you, if it blows up.

Reminds me of people on cooking sites who say, "I know I'm not supposed to, but how dangerous is it really, if I ... "
Vilsen
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Re: Can I still use 17.3?

Post by Vilsen »

Now I get confused, I had that understanding

that Linux was basically so secure

that no virus or malware could compromise with it
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Re: Can I still use 17.3?

Post by DAMIEN1307 »

Now I get confused, I had that understanding

that Linux was basically so secure

that no virus or malware could compromise with it
It IS secure provided that its LTS kernel that was installed can still be updated for security updates and bug fixes through the update manager being able to access repositories, servers etc. same with software updates that also come through via the same method.

Since 17.3 is now EOL and its repositories are no longer in existance since its EOL, as well as update manager also not updated nor supported anymore, security can no longer be updated, "guaranteed", nor be expected and indeed is no longer considered secured after its EOL...It is now considered "fair game"...nothing in this world or this life lasts forever and neither does any operating system made by the hand of man...You buy a newer car when your present one wears out or you can no longer find parts for it...You replace household appliances in likewise fashion...You buy new clothes when the old ones are worn out or out of fashion...what makes anyone think that a computer or computer operating system is any different ???...DAMIEN
Last edited by DAMIEN1307 on Fri May 08, 2020 3:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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rene
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Re: Can I still use 17.3?

Post by rene »

Vilsen wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 2:30 pm
Now I get confused
Confused about which of the bits of advise you were given? The majority seems to say you'll be fine, with me personally adding in that manually updating Firefox and/or Thunderbird may be useful, or at least, is quite possible. Together those constitute 99% of the attack surface of a default Linux Mint install so unless you're doing specific stuff...
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Re: Can I still use 17.3?

Post by pbear »

Vilsen wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 2:30 pm
Now I get confused, I had that understanding

that Linux was basically so secure

that no virus or malware could compromise with it
Not true, never was. In any event, the general advice that one need not have antivirus in Linux is premised on staying current with security patches.

Anyhoo, rene has given you permission to proceed. That's what you wanted, right? Someone to tell you it's okay? Done. Good luck.
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