2 Weeks into Linux - Biggest Bugs Report

[valiantgenomics]

I installed Linux for the first time in my life, 2 weeks ago. And I'm really loving it.

Mint has been great so far, with a few minor bugs here and there.

But the applets/tray icons is by far the most bug-riddled part of Mint. The entire icon tray is so bugged that's it's practically unusable for me.



There are so many bugs there, that I don't know even where to start.

Are there any plans to fix this in the near future? Is it even being discussed? I assume it has to be, it's so glitchy that I can't see how the dev team isn't discussing it.

Everything else in Mint is otherwise stellar. I'm teaching myself the basics of Linux and making it my permanent new home.

[Moem]

There are so many bugs there, that I don't know even where to start.

Then we can't know what problems you are experiencing, and whether or not they are valid bugs. We also don't know which version of Mint*, and which desktop environment you are using. As it is, this topic is not very useful. But I bet you can fill us in, and flesh it out a little more. Maybe we can help you solve some of the problems you are having!

*I'm assuming that you are using Mint.

[AndyMH]

Maybe you could start with posting an image that we can view?

[valiantgenomics]

There are so many bugs there, that I don't know even where to start.

Then we can't know what problems you are experiencing, and whether or not they are valid bugs. We also don't know which version of Mint*, and which desktop environment you are using. As it is, this topic is not very useful. But I bet you can fill us in, and flesh it out a little more. Maybe we can help you solve some of the problems you are having!

*I'm assuming that you are using Mint.

Thanks a ton for the reply! I didn't provide more info because in order to properly showcase the bugs, I need to do video screen recordings and even then I'm not sure if I can fully explain them because the bugs seem to be so intertwined. Trying to fix one bug and going into settings only to find another bug, and trying to fix that one I'm faced with yet another.

For example, I wanted to add a 2nd language so I can switch back and forth between it and English (UK). I then tried the default key combination (shortcut) to switch back and forth between the languages. It didn't work. So I went into settings to change the shortcut to something else, but was not possible to change it. It doesn't read my key input. I finally managed to change it somehow after 1 hour of tinkering but then the applet icon disappeared all of a sudden leaving me with the non-English language. I went into applets, trying to recover the tray icon so I can revert to English but when I recovered the icon, only the non-English language appeared and all of a sudden I also got English (US). Finally, after 2 hours of battling this, I restarted my computer and deleted the non-English language so this never happens again. Now, I'm back to only using English (UK).

You can see by my convoluted description how intertwined this particular bug is. I don't even know what's causing it and where to start since there's a bug on every step. Switch-language tray icon bugged ---> switch-language shortcut bugged ---> tray icons disappearing bug ---> new language appearing out of nowhere bug ---> trying to restore tray icon, restores the incorrect tray icon ---> and so forth

---------------------------

Another less convoluted bug is some tray icons seem glued together. For example if I want to reposition one, 2 other icons move with it. Therefore, I can't move only the icon that I intended to move in the first place, without moving the other 2.

Hopefully this provides some context. But this is just scratching the surface.

And I'm using Mint 21, Cinnamon. But I was wondering if going back to 20.3 would be better?

In any case, I will power through this no matter what. Mint WILL be my daily driver. In fact, I get excited when I encounter a bug because in it, there's an opportunity to learn something new.

[Cosmo.]

But I was wondering if going back to 20.3 would be better?

Boot the live system of Cinnamon 20.3 and find out.

[Moem]

Thanks a ton for the reply! I didn't provide more info because in order to properly showcase the bugs, I need to do video screen recordings and even then I'm not sure if I can fully explain them because the bugs seem to be so intertwined.

You keep saying bugs. I'm not yet fully convinced that they are. But if they are, the place to report them is not here; this forum however is a good place to find out whether they are indeed bugs. Read more about bug reporting on Mint here: https://projects.linuxmint.com/reporting-an-issue.html

Another less convoluted bug is some tray icons seem glued together. For example if I want to reposition one, 2 other icons move with it. Therefore, I can't move only the icon that I intended to move in the first place, without moving the other 2.

That's not a bug. That is how the system tray, that holds a specific selection of icons, works. It's a feature that you may or may not like but I don't think it's unintentional.

And I'm using Mint 21, Cinnamon. But I was wondering if going back to 20.3 would be better?

It could be. A x.0 release is never as polished as the following x.1, x.2 and x.3 releases; those upgrades do come along to iron out the bugs. Each new version should bring refinements. Some people, for that reason, never jump on a new version until it's at least x.1 or later. There's some sense in that. Personally, I'm happy with 21, but not everyone is.

[valiantgenomics]

You keep saying bugs. I'm not yet fully convinced that they are. But if they are, the place to report them is not here; this forum however is a good place to find out whether they are indeed bugs. Read more about bug reporting on Mint here: https://projects.linuxmint.com/reporting-an-issue.html

That is 100% a bug. Literally as I was typing my response to you my keyboard switched to the non-English language on its own. Which, as stated above, I already deleted an hour ago. So I had to restart my pc to fix it.

That's not a bug. That is how the system tray, that holds a specific selection of icons, works. It's a feature that you may or may not like but I don't think it's unintentional.

If this isn't a bug but a feature, then I don't understand why the software manager applet icon would be glued to my volume icon, or why my VPN icon would be glued to my Bluetooth icon and also to QRedshift. And I can't move one without the other. That is a really weird feature.

It could be. A x.0 release is never as polished as the following x.1, x.2 and x.3 releases; those upgrades do come along to iron out the bugs. Each new version should bring refinements. Some people, for that reason, never jump on a new version until it's at least x.1 or later. There's some sense in that. Personally, I'm happy with 21, but not everyone is.

Yes, I'll be doing just that. I'm gonna reinstall Mint to 20.3 and see how that performs.

Thanks a lot for your time and help

[Cosmo.]

If this isn't a bug but a feature, then I don't understand why the software manager applet icon would be glued to my volume icon, or why my VPN icon would be glued to my Bluetooth icon and also to QRedshift. And I can't move one without the other. That is a really weird feature.

Because they all do not exist immediately in the panel (like the menu or the calendar, both are separate applets), but they live inside of the tray applet. You cannot move or drag them outside of the tray applet, either they are inside of it or do not appear at all.

Are you able to place in Windows tray icons on a custom place. My time with Windows is 15 years back, but I am sure, that at that time this was impossible.

[valiantgenomics]

If this isn't a bug but a feature, then I don't understand why the software manager applet icon would be glued to my volume icon, or why my VPN icon would be glued to my Bluetooth icon and also to QRedshift. And I can't move one without the other. That is a really weird feature.

Because they all do not exist immediately in the panel (like the menu or the calendar, both are separate applets), but they live inside of the tray applet. You cannot move or drag them outside of the tray applet, either they are inside of it or do not appear at all.

Are you able to place in Windows tray icons on a custom place. My time with Windows is 15 years back, but I am sure, that at that time this was impossible.

I see, thanks for letting me know. But I'm not sure if you understood me. I'm not trying to drag them outside of the tray applet, I'm merely trying to reorganise the tray applets placings. For example, instead of having Volume icon, VPN, QRedshift, Bluetooth, WiFi. I want to change the order to Volume icon, WiFi, Bluetooth, VPN, QRedshift.

I've never tried doing so in Windows. There could've been a way to do it.

BTW do you happen to know what's the command for switching between languages? I want to try setting up a custom shortcut, that might overwrite the existing settings, or should I say non-existing settings.

[Moem]

I think we need to clarify some terminology here...
Panel: the bar at the bottom (can also be elsewhere) of the screen, that hosts the applets.
Applets: small programs that provide access to often-used features. The menu button is an applet; so is the launcher bar (left area of the panel) and the clock on the panel. Most applets look like an icon.
System tray: a specific applet, that lives on the panel and holds a specific collection of icons. The system tray can be switched on or off, or can be moved as a whole; the icons that live inside it can not be swapped, or moved out of the tray.

I hope this helps a bit!

[Moem]

do you happen to know what's the command for switching between languages? I want to try setting up a custom shortcut, that might overwrite the existing settings, or should I say non-existing settings.

They're existing in a different place:
go to the Keyboard Layouts tab, find the button Options... at the right hand bottom, open that. One of the options on the list is called Switching to another layout. That's what you're looking for.

[zcot]

This example is Xfce, but it easily shows the complexity of what is involved with the tray, and why the way that it is.

check left to right(read the right hand window listing), clipman, notif area, notif plugin, xapp, etc.

So those can be arranged. However there are 2 of those areas that encapsulate potential multiple other icons.

And there are probably at least 3 common ways for a program to communicate / integrate and use tray functionality.

Notification Area, and XApp status, both of those can/will hold other icons, it's based on how programs communicate their tray situation.

In the example I have HexChat, the second tray icon, that's actually working inside the Notification Area plugin, and then you can see on the left window where any programs integrating with that notif area plugin functionality can be managed.

The XApp section, that's holding 2 icons in the tray, network, and update manager. And I can not change the order of those 2(or more) easily. You would have to do complete reconfiguration of those tray plugin setups. XApp plug is not offering easy management there.

So, missing features do not constitute using "bug" as terminology. For full absolute position control there would have to be potential multiple instances of the Notification plugin(only handling 1 single item), and multiple XApp plugs possibly only handling a single app communication, -it depends on how you would suspect you wanted them to be ordered ultimately.

[RollyShed]

If this isn't a bug but a feature, then I don't understand why the software manager applet icon would be glued to my volume icon, or why my VPN icon would be glued to my Bluetooth icon and also to QRedshift. And I can't move one without the other. That is a really weird feature.

Right click on the middle of the panel, "Panel edit mode" ON. Drag the right hand icons to the order you want them in.

The left hand icons don't need "Panel edit mode" ON for changing their order.
You do need to move things carefully but they are all movable to which ever order you want. Just done it.

As for language swapping, I'd expect few users do that so you might have problems finding someone with that problem.

[Cosmo.]

I see, thanks for letting me know. But I'm not sure if you understood me. I'm not trying to drag them outside of the tray applet, I'm merely trying to reorganise the tray applets placings. For example, instead of having Volume icon, VPN, QRedshift, Bluetooth, WiFi. I want to change the order to Volume icon, WiFi, Bluetooth, VPN, QRedshift.

Yet, I did understand you. You wrote:

If this isn't a bug but a feature, then I don't understand why the software manager applet icon would be glued to my volume icon, or why my VPN icon would be glued to my Bluetooth icon and also to QRedshift. And I can't move one without the other. That is a really weird feature.

Hard to misunderstand.

Tray icons get displayed in the reversed order the respective programs get launched, you cannot influence the tray icon order except by manually launching the respective programs in a fixed order. If VPN and Bluetooth and whatever else provide a tray icon, than these tray icons gets displayed at the only technically possible place: the tray applet. As there is only one tray they is one tray icon besides the other. I wonder which OS did bring you to the idea, that the icons could be placed at very individually set places.

So at the end: What you want (first quote above) is not doable.

Besides that: In this quote there is a mistake: The volume icon (correctly: sound icon) is not a tray icon, but an applet. You can move it separately. In this point your complain is not valid.

Regarding the shortcut for switching the keyboard layouts: Moem showed you already the way, but actually you can simply use the existing default shortcut: Super-space

[decrepit]

Hi guys, I've lived with Mate for years, and have always been able to move panel icons around.
I installed Cinnamon to try it out, and like vallantgenomics, was annoyed by not being able to move icons individually. So my advice is to try mate and see if you get on any better.

[Hoser Rob]

Thanks a ton for the reply! I didn't provide more info because in order to properly showcase the bugs, I need to do video screen recordings and even then I'm not sure if I can fully explain them because the bugs seem to be so intertwined.

You keep saying bugs. I'm not yet fully convinced that they are. But if they are, the place to report them is not here; this forum however is a good place to find out whether they are indeed bugs. Read more about bug reporting on Mint here: https://projects.linuxmint.com/reporting-an-issue.html

I'm not convinced these are bugs either. There are many subtle ways users can screw up their systems, esp. with a web upgrade involved.

PLease post system info, copy/paste the text output of inxi -Fxxxrz run in the terminal.

[valiantgenomics]

Thanks for all of the replies. I appreciate each one of you.

I reinstalled Mint and it's performing better now. Less glitches. Still can't move some icons around but that's fine, I'm not paying attention to that.

Hi guys, I've lived with Mate for years, and have always been able to move panel icons around.
I installed Cinnamon to try it out, and like vallantgenomics, was annoyed by not being able to move icons individually. So my advice is to try mate and see if you get on any better.

Thanks for mentioning this. I was starting to doubt my sanity.

[Moem]

I reinstalled Mint and it's performing better now. Less glitches.

I'm glad to hear that!