Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

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kaszasp
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by kaszasp »

Dear Fellas,

So I got some problems from this fglrx, as seen here: http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=90&t=216733 I wanted to revert to the old screen device driver because I had funny distorted screens after coming back from hibernation.

Someone asked about how I calculated slowness and from what point to what point. The answer is, always from the same point to the same point. In other words, it does not matter from where to where, because the measurement points were not changed. BTW, I have automated logon, no GRUB. And it is not only the system boot but also all programs, Chromium included.

My notebook is still the same slow, while it is pretty new and powerful and used to be very quick in both booting and program launches. I think I will have to accept that. If it worsens with time, maybe I will reinstall every few months - wait, is that not what you would do with a Windows..??

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atari800
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by atari800 »

I havent seen linux get progressively slower but as you pointed out, Windows does.
If you are planning to reinstall, on my previous suggestion of BLEACHBIT, NOATIME & PRELINK/PRELOAD, would you consider give that a shot?

I guess this is more for my curiosity
I am thinking as you get progressively slower over time that some massive log file or journal is being updated and growing which takes longer and longer to seek to the end, or rotate or whatever

If the suggestion of using a different graphics driver rendered you unable to function, and cannot function, I can understand not able to proceed
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Pjotr
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by Pjotr »

atari800 wrote:BLEACHBIT,
Bad advice... Don't ever use BleachBit: it's useless at best, and can cause massive system damage. :shock:
NOATIME
That might help. :)
PRELINK/PRELOAD
In certain circumstances, this can cause a lot of *extra* system load. Personally, I therefore definitely don't want that enabled in my systems.
I am thinking as you get progressively slower over time that some massive log file or journal is being updated and growing which takes longer and longer to seek to the end, or rotate or whatever
Might be so. Check the size of your logs.
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Dave B
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by Dave B »

Hi kaszasp,

While won't help with boot times, to try and help isolate the issue, you could try setting up an extra user account, and see if you experience the same software start times with the other account?

David

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atari800
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by atari800 »

@PJOTR
Where is this "Bleachbit bad" forum I can read up on all of the destruction?

Maybe I am damaging my system without knowing about it.


But I cant find any catastrophy stories on bleachbit except for this:
https://www.bleachbit.org/forum/bad-piece-software
from 2009 - 7 years ago

However, if there is a "warning dialog box" that pops up when you are selecting choices, click cancel/no


Plus this guy is going to reinstall anyways... if he is sincere about that, all that can happen is he reports back
"Bleachbit is an explosive and ruined my system more than using wrong graphics drivers"
or it worked
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Cosmo.
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by Cosmo. »

atari800 wrote:Where is this "Bleachbit bad" forum I can read up on all of the destruction?
That is not the point.

The point is: What does Bleachbit offer? Is this really needed and does it make sense? Can those tasks also be done with other measurements, e.g. with tools of the system or the related programs?
This leads easily to the question: Why BB at all?

The other point is the experience in the forum, that users did fall into problems, which would not have happened with that program.

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atari800
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by atari800 »

Cosmo. wrote:That is not the point.

The point is: What does Bleachbit offer? Is this really needed and does it make sense? Can those tasks also be done with other measurements, e.g. with tools of the system or the related programs?
This leads easily to the question: Why BB at all?

The other point is the experience in the forum, that users did fall into problems, which would not have happened with that program.
The point is you say it is bad to use BB but dont give a reference to WHY.

What does BB offer? Unless it is applied and OP says "nothing happened", we dont know.
He mentions "Chromium launched in 3 secs flat." then over time "Chromium launches in 20 sec"
BB has options to clean Chromium

Chromium
Web browser


Cache: Delete the web cache, which reduces time to display revisited pages

Cookies: Delete cookies, which contain information such as web site preferences, authentication, and tracking identification

Current session: Delete the current session

DOM Storage: Delete HTML5 cookies

Form history: A history of forms entered in web sites

History: Delete the history which includes visited sites, downloads, and thumbnails

Passwords: A database of usernames and passwords as well as a list of sites that should not store passwords

Search engines: Reset the search engine usage history and delete non-factory search engines, some of which are added automatically

Vacuum: Clean database fragmentation to reduce space and improve speed without removing any data

Is this really needed and does it make sense?
A suggestion to this guy was to try a different graphics driver - how does this fit into boot time? Does that make sense?

Can those tasks also be done with other measurements, e.g. with tools of the system or the related programs?
Why not Bleachbit? I cannot locate any forum thread of Bleachbit destroying machines
If you can point me to it and it is not a 9 year old thread, then I will read it, judge it and quite possibly change my opinion of it

The other point is the experience in the forum, that users did fall into problems, which would not have happened with that program.
Can you point me to some threads? I open to learning about these types of apps
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Pjotr
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by Pjotr »

atari800 wrote:The point is you say it is bad to use BB but dont give a reference to WHY.
One example: http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.p ... 8#p1068448
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Cosmo.
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by Cosmo. »

In regard of what BB does offer you mainly listed some functions of the browser. Chromium does not offer those functions? :shock: I use FF and FF - in the one or other case with the help of an extension - can do it. - Automatically added search engines: Mozilla did do some change in the browser to avoid that; no need to "clean" anything, what does not exist for some months. - Regarding vacuum: what databases? Any proof, that this has a practical effect? Many databases are built for quick access to a needed portion of the stored information and don't need such feature.

I cannot count how often I wrote about that matter myself or how often I read posts from other users. I also cannot count, how often we came to the finding, that a reported problem could get braked down to bleachbit. I also do not write a personal log about the topics where I am writing. But I have a rather good overview in head, what I did in the last weeks or months. If you want to read those threads: Either you or I had to do a search in the forum. I prefer that you do.

Point is here, that the OP - as far as we know at now - does not have a BB-problem. But the advice to install and use it does likely create a problem. The goal of the forum and wish of the OP is to solve a problem.
This is in this case especially problematic, as you simply assumed, that the source of the problem might be log files. As the speed problem does also occur for launching programs this is very unlikely. The xsession-errors log, which might probably be related with launching programs, gets by default limited to 200 kb, nothing, what can affect speed in the least noticeable amount.

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atari800
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by atari800 »

@Pjotr
Thanks for the link

That example, other than Xenopeek looking at the OP stating Bleachbit was used then wiped out his XDG_RUNTIME_DIR doesnt look like much triage.
I am not going to say I am right and he was wrong.
But at least you pointed me to a thread I can study up on.

@Cosmo
I am not the architect of Bleachbit. I am not the architect of Chromium and why it functions the way it does.
I have no clue if the OP uses Firefox and if so, what extension he uses.
I dont know why Mozilla made an initial bad decision on adding search engines.

As far as FF databases, go to about:config
search for vacuum
See anything?
Here is a neat little article as well: https://blogs.gnome.org/jnelson/2015/01 ... to_vacuum/


This guy had a dozen ideas tossed at him and nothing worked.
We know he gets progressively slower over time.

He is going to reinstall
Why not BB?
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Pjotr
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by Pjotr »

Other rather recent examples:
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=189293

and:
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.p ... 3#p1109595

Unfortunately, there's much more if you seek for it....
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atari800
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by atari800 »

Well those topics are someone executing WIPEDISK and interrupting it or it being interrupted, not understanding wipedisk
And granted a novice user can do damage to a machine with Bleachbit or even fdisk or dd
Techincally, this statement is deadly:
"Use DD to benchmark your drive"
A "novice" could enter in dd parameters to write to /dev/sda and zap their setup.
Is that the fault of DD, or the user?


I have search Linux Mint Forums and honestly, I find most "DONT USE BLEACHBIT" are from you and cosmo.

I find a lot of "no problems running bleachbit" statements too
Here is a nice write up
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.p ... t#p1089704


TO ORIGINAL POSTER:
Use common sense with any program, especially if you use it with elevated privileges
If you see a warning on an operation, cancel out of the operation and study up on that feature
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prestonR
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by prestonR »

atari800
They are right. Of course you're free to use it, just don't recommended it to newbies looking for CCleaner. My very first and last use of BB ended in disaster.
Having Bleachbit pre-installed is/was a terrible idea. Mint's success, and therefore it's continuing development, depends more than other distros on it's ready usability for people coming from commercial Os's. I think it's vital to point out the traps for new users.

Bleachbit creates two folders with a random name; one in /home and a second hidden one in your /root directory. The folders contain huge numbers of tiny files that are supposed to be deleted after a successful run. If Bleachbit is interrupted or crashes they will fill your drive and hang any attempt to open or delete them. Getting rid of them takes hours and should best be done over night.
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.p ... 17#p966806
Use common sense with any program
Of course, but remember that most new users are not only exited but also a bit intimidated by the new environment. They managed install, now they are exploring, looking for 'similarities', programs they believe they know what they do. Until BB proves them wrong...

Cosmo.
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by Cosmo. »

atari800 wrote:Here is a neat little article as well: https://blogs.gnome.org/jnelson/2015/01 ... to_vacuum/
Did you read it? What I read is (excerpted):
I know VACUUM has been a recurring issue for Firefox
...
running vacuum everyday provides no significant benefit (it only provides a benefit when there’s a significant amount of stuff to vacuum). If you’re vacuuming on every startup, you’re using a nuclear weapon to dig a hole in a small garden.
...
VACUUM is not a fine-tuned solver of problems, it’s a big red RESET button on your database’s on-disk layout. It really is the nuclear option.
...
My advice? Anyone considering VACUUM should first ask themselves if it’s necessary at all.
...
Your database may never need to be vacuumed, ever.
...
VACUUM is not a magic bullet to make it faster
Or in short:
Cosmo. wrote:Many databases ... don't need such feature.

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atari800
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by atari800 »

@kaszasp
Run this and let see if we can identify any abnormally large directories, this might reveal a clue

Code: Select all

cd /
sudo du -sk * | sort -n | while read size fname; do for unit in k M G T P E Z Y; do if [ $size -lt 1024 ]; then echo -e "${size}${unit}\t${fname}"; break; fi; size=$((size/1024)); done; done
@Cosmo
Im if sorry I bruised your ego but if you want to open a thread on Firefox, sqlite databases being vaccumed, Chromium missing features, search engines, Bleachbit, xsession-error logs, system tools, malware and other "software wrecking balls", start a thread. I'd like to participate

but not to take this post off topic... Lets recap
His issue is that he gets progressively slower
This guy tried

Disable autologin (suggested by cosmo)

Try Bleachbit (suggested by Atari)
Try NOATIME (suggested by Atari)
TRY PRELINK/PRELOAD (suggested by Atari)
Look at DMESG after boot (suggested by Atari)

smartctl (suggested by Mute Ant)

Try setting up another account (suggested by David Black)

Try new non-free driver (suggested by Pjotr)
Try new kernel (suggested by Pjotr)
Try new UEFI (suggested by Pjotr)
Disable hardware acceleration (suggested by Pjotr)
Try some speed tweeks (suggested by Pjotr)
Disable IPv6 (suggested by Pjotr)
Optimize wireless (suggested by Pjotr)
Use a non hidden SSID (suggested by Pjotr)
Use WPA2 personal with AES only (suggested by Pjotr)

Try a network cable vs wireless (suggested by Rollem)
Look at top (suggested by Rollem)

Look at system monitor (suggested by Reorx)


Now if this guy gets progressivley slower...
Disabling autologin --- not sure what this will do
Bleachbit - other than causing a thread to go off topic completely - is unknown
NOATIME - this can drastically speed up disk io - unknown if he tried
PRELINK/PRELOAD - can help in app loading speed a little - unknown if he tried
DMESG - can see if the system is have some behind the scenes issue - unknown if tried
SMARTCTL - can report drive health conditions
SETUP ANOTHER ACCOUNT - this sound like a great idea
NON-FREE DRIVER - ok I can see a speed potential based on what got installed but still, this guy has slowness over time
NEW KERNEL - good idea
NEW UEFI - this to me is dangerous as ASUS and ECS manuals almost state dont upgrade unless you absolutely need some missing funtionality
DISABLE HARDWARE ACCELERATION - this seems more of a video/web suggestion
SPEED TWEAKS - good idea
DISABLE IPv6 - network suggestion, not sure how this fits to progressivly slowing down
OPTIMIZE WIRELESS - same
USE NON-HIDDEN SSID -same
USE WPA2 - same
TRY NETWORK CABLE - same
TOP - great idea - see whats hogging the CPU
SYSTEM MONITOR - great idea - look at resources

Or in short:
atari800 wrote:...he gets progressively slower
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harryhole
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Re: Linux Mint 17.2 slowing down

Post by harryhole »

@Atari
At last someone who understands that the "why" and the "why not" are an intrinsic part of offering advice/help.
Too often the advice in this forum is proscriptive with no reasoning given - ok suppose Bleachbit is the spawn of the devil, really, how so, and more important yet, if I'm not to use it then what are the alternatives and why are they better.
Thank you for a great resume and sound advice - sorry if this drags it off topic again, but I don't have the experience to suggest a possible solution to the o.p.

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