Confusion .... What don't I understand ?

[spamegg]

This has happened twice to me in less than six months, so it is definitely a thing.

Yep, we need to tell newcomers more honestly how Linux works.
There are many "well-meaning, wishful lies", as I'd like to call them, out there on the web (not so much here). (And a few ill-intended ones too )
Suggesting things like "your PC will run much faster on Linux, it's more lightweight, takes up less disk space too!" or "don't worry all your Windows apps / games will work just fine, even faster!" or "it's super easy to customize Linux and backup / save all your settings / software, it just works!" or "just use separate home partition, everything will work after an upgrade!" Just not true.
Most of it comes from either ignorance or having high expectations. As the article explains https://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm in order to justify the time / effort of switching from Windows, people expect Linux to be better than, but also the same as, Windows.

[gittiest personITW]

To add to what Spamegg said,
Yes, but also people should be aware that a different operating system will be 'different' - doesn't matter whether you swap to/from Windows etc.
Should they be made aware before installing a new OS. or does everyone assume that people just know that? It might not be that obvious for most general Windows users. (Don't mean to be denigrating but most people just use their computer as a tool and don't know that they are even using something called an Operating System)

Different can mean better or worse. There is still 1 program I really miss - IrfanView - from Windows but I'm not going to use WINE. Kolourpaint seems to do most of what I want - it just takes me a little longer to do some stuff.
Most other tasks are better or the same. For instance I get the same experience from LibreOffice as I did from an older version of MS Office I used, which works fine for me as I want my data to be 'local' as much as possible - and I kept away from the shiny new versions that may or may not allow you to save your documents to your own hard drive.

Mint IS less resource hungry than Windows. For instance Cinnamon uses a lot less and needs a lot less than Win11.
Mate and XFCE - which are amazing in their own right are perfect for older systems.
However, Mint isn't ideal for everything. CAD/gaming/DTP (compared to Apple) etc, but this isn't Mint's fault.
This is because people/companies might not want to be lumbered with providing free/cheap complicated software and updates for (maybe) 3% of computer users of which maybe only 5% of them might be tempted to use such software, versus Windows with probably about 75% share of which maybe 5% will purchase that software. Not commercially viable for Linux/Mint.

[Newbie221]

To add to what Spamegg said,
Yes, but also people should be aware that a different operating system will be 'different' - doesn't matter whether you swap to/from Windows etc.
Should they be made aware before installing a new OS. or does everyone assume that people just know that? It might not be that obvious for most general Windows users.

I would counter with this doesn't appear to be an issue with Windows users understanding that Apple is a different OS. A vast majority of the people I've conversed with over the years without doubt understand this.
So I would ask this question. If the face of Linux was more associated with the Gnome desktop, instead of Cinnamon, would people assume Linux to be an Apple replacement ?
I say this simply because when doing my research on Linux a large portion of what I encountered was hey windows users, look we'll be an easy transition.
Our desktop is the same.


Thanks for your time
Newbie221

[gittiest personITW]

Depends on how pedantic we are trying to get.

Most people understand that Apple and Microsoft are different, but then we are also talking the difference between hardware and software - so people in the latter camp might not actually understand what an operating system is. A lot of people I know switch on their device - they might know it is Windows, but not which version. They might not know that they are booting into an 'Operating System'. It just 'is'.
Those with Apples tend to know exactly what OS they are using as the next OS update will likely make their hardware unusable. Quite similar to Windows users in that respect but they are probably more aware of the fact.

[MurphCID]

Yes, if Gnome was standard across all distros, people would assume it is a 3rd rate Mac knock off. I, for one, am glad it is not a standard, since I prefer Cinnamon. Plus Gnome has a bad habit of not fixing bugs, ignoring their users, and deciding what is best, in their opinion. Plus it is not nearly as attractive or polished as the Mac OS interface. But Linux in general could really use some graphic artists to give it an appearance makeover. KDE does pretty well, but it uses QT vs GTK, which could be the reason.

The Cinnamon desktop generally looks better than any desktop except KDE, since the Cinnamon devs take more care, and the icons, fonts, etc look less 2000's than the other desktops.

[Hoser Rob]

Also developers can decide to "improve" (remove) features you liked and used for years, or make breaking changes often (lack of backwards compatibility).

This has happened twice to me in less than six months, so it is definitely a thing.

I've been seeing new users here for a few years who had Windows 10/11 and installed Linux because a Windows update broke some peripheral. My reaction was basically "jeez, Windows is becoming like Linux now?" I mean, Linux updates have been breaking things for a long time. I can think of a number of good reasons to install Linux but I'm not sure that's one of them.

The constant adding of new features can be annoying too. That's a FOSS syndrome. The devs of these programs have other paying jobs, they are not paid to do these programs. Fixing bugs and doing maintenance is boring. Really it's drudge work. You'd really have to pay people to do it in general. Whereas adding new features and rewriting code is a lot more fun. So rather than getting bugs fixed new and yes, sometimes pointless, features are added. You can never assume that a new version of a program is better.

[spamegg]

My reaction was basically "jeez, Windows is becoming like Linux now?"

[TaterChip]

This has happened twice to me in less than six months, so it is definitely a thing.

Yep, we need to tell newcomers more honestly how Linux works.
There are many "well-meaning, wishful lies", as I'd like to call them, out there on the web (not so much here). (And a few ill-intended ones too )
Suggesting things like "your PC will run much faster on Linux, it's more lightweight, takes up less disk space too!" or "don't worry all your Windows apps / games will work just fine, even faster!" or "it's super easy to customize Linux and backup / save all your settings / software, it just works!" or "just use separate home partition, everything will work after an upgrade!" Just not true.
Most of it comes from either ignorance or having high expectations. As the article explains https://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm in order to justify the time / effort of switching from Windows, people expect Linux to be better than, but also the same as, Windows.

As someone that divorced Microsoft after 30+ years, and is a somewhat recent convert to Linux, I can definitely state that Linux IS better than Windows. Although I did come over with the knowledge I would potentially have to find a whole new suite of programs to complete my tasks. I started a little early by learning cross platform programs to make my transition easier.

[TaterChip]

The constant adding of new features can be annoying too. That's a FOSS syndrome. The devs of these programs have other paying jobs, they are not paid to do these programs. Fixing bugs and doing maintenance is boring. Really it's drudge work. You'd really have to pay people to do it in general. Whereas adding new features and rewriting code is a lot more fun. So rather than getting bugs fixed new and yes, sometimes pointless, features are added. You can never assume that a new version of a program is better.

My biggest gripe is when devs start removing features.

after my stroke I relied heavily on Speech Note, the speech to text software, to type since my left hand was useless. Before the stroke I was typing close to 45 wpm. After I was relegated to hunting and pecking with my right hand. The devs removed the ability to have a right click menu which made it easier to have the copy/paste options. Sure the keyboard shortcuts are still there, however those are best used by my screwed up left hand.

I am still a right hand only typer, only a bit faster at my hunting and pecking. The day a program I relied on became almost unusable because of an update was the day I deactivated the update manager and haven't looked back.

[spamegg]

As someone that divorced Microsoft after 30+ years, and is a somewhat recent convert to Linux, I can definitely state that Linux IS better than Windows. Although I did come over with the knowledge I would potentially have to find a whole new suite of programs to complete my tasks. I started a little early by learning cross platform programs to make my transition easier.

Great! That's the path I would recommend to people too. Slow learning, different expectations...

Unfortunately some newcomers have very different expectations, expecting everything to work out of the box perfectly, and they don't do the kind of learning you did. Not their fault either, they are misled by internet memes and crappy article websites.

So in my comments I am often considering the worst possible experiences, not the better, or even average ones. I assume that people are led to Linux with the worst / most misleading info / expectations.

[TaterChip]

As someone that divorced Microsoft after 30+ years, and is a somewhat recent convert to Linux, I can definitely state that Linux IS better than Windows. Although I did come over with the knowledge I would potentially have to find a whole new suite of programs to complete my tasks. I started a little early by learning cross platform programs to make my transition easier.

Great! That's the path I would recommend to people too. Slow learning, different expectations...

My expectations had already been tempered by two previous attempts at switching and failure. Once around mint 14 I think. Again with Mint 17. I wasn't able to make the switch till 21.1

Unfortunately some newcomers have very different expectations, expecting everything to work out of the box perfectly, and they don't do the kind of learning you did. Not their fault either, they are misled by internet memes and crappy article websites.

So in my comments I am often considering the worst possible experiences, not the better, or even average ones. I assume that people are led to Linux with the worst / most misleading info / expectations.

Agreed... that's why when someone claims (insert whatever) is the best thing since sliced bread, I tend to take everything they say with a grain of salt. I tend to have different experiences.

Even when reading reviews, I gravitate to the one and two stars. I've been approached by too many companies that tried to buy my integrity when I left truthful reviews. Because of that, IMO the low reviews are potentially the only true reviews. I even had one company tell me they would only honor their warranty AFTER I changed my review to a 5 star. It got downgraded to a 1 star and I pasted their email in a review update. IF they would have honored their warranty without the blackmail the review would have been updated with a 4 star, and explanation that they stood behind their products.

So I'm thankful to those that offer up either average or worst possible outcomes.