Old nVidia FX5200 AGP + Mint 14 Xfce = ISSUES

[MtnDewManiac]

Hello,

Was so happy that Mint Xfce breathed new life/power into my laptop... for a few days. Booted it today and the fan sounded like my Escort did when the throwout bearing exploded, now it wants to melt.

I have this old desktop, I think from 2002. It has an nVidia-type FX5200 or 5200FX (not sure which) AGP graphics card. It's 128meg. 4 or 8x AGP I think.

If I remember correctly, it either takes 173 nVidia or if not that one then the old one, 90something. But it's a hardware graphics card, not the pretend kind that some motherboards have - so that means I have hardware graphics acceleration, right? I hope so, I read that's important.

Anyway, I have issues - and so does my desktop, lol. Learned the secret of installing Mint Xfce on it was to remove the screenshow. Done and done, Mint Xfce is installed.

FIrst boot, can't read anything, too small. Set me up with 1280*1024 lol and the screen... I can't tell by looking straight at it, but I look out of the corner of my eye, looks like the whole screen is almost-but-not-quite flashing(!), I guess that means the refresh rate is too slow.

Found Display in settings (great idea, placing all settings in one menu, btw). Selected 1024*768 - screen dark magenta tint. Change back. Try again - screen dark cyan tint. Change back. Try again - screen looks correct colors (or maybe none?) but way too dark. Change back, try again, get the dark magenta again. Change back.

Remembered that the update app on the craptop had a drivers tab, was anti-helpful for it (had to edit out blacklist and install wifi driver manually), hoped it would have nvidia on desktop and actually work this time. Saw that it did. Tried it.

Success and failure. It took it. Still wants to boot at 1280*1024 (that's interlaced on old small CRT monitor!). Tried to set for 1024*768, best refresh rate is suddenly 60, should be higher if I remember correctly. Tried 800*600, that let me pick (ujp to) 70hz refresh rate or whatever it's called, and I JKNOW that's wrong because it was always 85 hz before.

When I boot and shutdown, have garbage text. Desktop looks... like a desktop, but obviously something isn't right.

System is fresh. All stock install (with broken screenshow removed to make install process work, y'all really ought to take the Xfce .iso down and put up one with the slideshow removed, I don't know about installing some strange, uncommon app and expecting it to work - but the actual OS INSTALL should work without screwing with the thing on each and every computer that the OS creator specifies it works on. I'm just saying, lol, I really like Mint but I am persistent enough to try to get something to work, Joe User will try, fail, throw DVD in trash, burn a new one, try, fail, throw that one in trash, and decide the OS just doesn't work right.)

Anyway, all I have done so far was to install Mint 14 Xfce, click on the update shield icon thing to make that app big, go to software sources and check all the options except for the source code ones and the one for cd/dvd or whatever, then let it update (updated the updater, then updated a bunch of other things). Then I told it on that last tab to use the nVidia driver.

What else do I need to do to make nVidia 5200FX (or FX5200) 128meg AGP video card work correctly? And if I need to do an additional step to accelerate my graphics instead of uhh... software(?) then please explain that.

<SIGH> Just last night before going to bed I thought, "All right, I have Mint 14 Xfce successfully installed to my laptop, have it cofigured more or less the way I want it, now I can relax and in the next week actually start reading in the forum and learning Mint." Then I turn on said laptop and it clicks, growls, vibrates like a concrete mixer, sounds like I threw a bicycle chain into a blender, and then the fan quits and temps go crazy. And it's two or maybe even three years newer than this old desktop, I only even keep the thing around because the laptop's CD/DVD drive never worked and I burn old time radio CDs for Mom and stuff. Well, and when Windows XP was new, I could play games in it. Haven't even tried in years (got divorced, told the ex to load up everything she wanted - she did, but must have assumed I meant to say, "And break everything you don't want," lol. Left the desktop and it survived being thrown down the basement steps, so I guess it has been a good one. But it's old and needs stuff done to make everything work when I install a linux OS and I am afraid I just lost the paper I wrote the directions on that I got when I installed Ultimate Edition 2.6 or whatever.

Feel free to use small words - I just don't feel like the "computer expert" that I did as a lad in 1981 when I first got my hands on one. And, well... It's really been a rough day.

Thanks in advance,
MDM

[kc1di]

Hello MtnDewManiac,

Nvidia legacy drivers are all available in mint go to synaptic and do a search for Nvidia and you should find nvidia 173 and 96 available one of those should work for your card.
install it and give it a try.

[MtnDewManiac]

Must be more to it than that. I have the 173 driver installed. Games crash when I try to play them now. Supertuxkart worked last OS, when I go to start a race now... Desktop.

Also, in nVidia X Server Settings, my X Server Display Configuration panel displays:

Unable to load X Server Display Configuration page:

The NVIDIA X driver on wes-desktop:0.0 is not new
enough to support the nvidia-settings Display Configuration page.

Do I need to load two drivers?

It worked in last linux OS, shouldn't it work better now? But I don't think I have 3d acceleration and my setup app is missing functionality.

I need to PPA something and then rig up a key so my system can... unlock it or something, right? Think I read about that kind of thing back when I was using Ultimate Edition 2.7 on this desktop, but I am afraid it didn't stick in my head because everything worked fine in that one. Besides, since I just formated my drive to install Mint Xfce, all my notes and bookmarked threads are umbawgwayed anyway. But I thought I needed an updated OS so it'd work better. Or, well... work[/]. Work is great, if I can get to "work," I will worry about "better" some other time. :weep:

-MDM

EDIT: Supertuxkart doesn't work, Netflix doesn't work... I cannot even play a Youtube video. And I took out Mint Flash and installed the flash plugin installer app so as to make sure I had a working flash (not positive this was necessary, but all the reviews in the software installation app seem to hate Mint Flash - and it worked fine that way on my laptop (until the thing melted ). In short, it appears I have the 173 nVidia driver - and it isn't accomplishing a thing.

EDIT #2: I decided to take a break from it and just view a video that I have on my hard drive. THAT doesn't work, either! I get sound and a picture of the video which changes "every once in a while" instead of however many times per second the "picture" changes in a video.

-MDM on a broken desktop

[MtnDewManiac]

I just saw in a thread to type inxi -Gx in a terminal. I did:

Graphics: Card: NVIDIA NV34 [GeForce FX 5200] bus-ID: 02:00.0
X.Org: 1.13.0 drivers: (unloaded: fbdev,vesa,nouveau) FAILED: nvidia Resolution: 1024x768@56.0hz
GLX Renderer: GeForce FX 5200/AGP/SSE/3DNOW! GLX Version: 2.1.2 NVIDIA 173.14.36 Direct Rendering: Yes

[MtnDewManiac]

Man this really sucks. It's hard to maintain excitement about something when it won't work right from step one. I found out on my own that it's not broken hardware, it's a known issue that whoever created the distro CBA about fixing and putting out a fixed .ISO. So I followed the directions to take out the slideshow and it let me install the OS. Then I learn that I don't have graphics with it, I have to make that work.

At this point, I should point out how lucky I am that I have a second computer that I can boot into and get on the Internet. Okay, first I had to know how to fix that problem. But then I got the wireless to work. And it is 26F outside right now, so I am able to actually use this second computer (this particular issue is mine - the fan exploded and so I can only use it outside in the snow/ice) to ask for help with the desktop.

I hate to think of all the prospective Mint users who don't have either the computer that whoever created Mint happened to have when he/she created it (I'm assuming that THAT computer works fine with no issues) or another working computer available with which to search and ask for help, btw. Those poor souls probably went back to Microsoft OS and, seeing as how that one tends to work on whatever computer one installs it on, they probably feel that it's the best OS - since it works.

But me, I want linux. So I keep muddling through. And every solution... Is nothing but yet another problem.

I found this thread:
http://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=102602

And tried to follow the directions in post #... well, this site doesn't number posts in a thread. But it's the long post with the directions which mention something about that way working without having to downgrade X. It might be the last one, IDK. Got to keep taking my glove off to use the mouse pad and it's cold out here, just trying to type is turning out to be an exercise in frustration (apologies).

Anyway, as that post instructed, I tried to install ppa-purge from https:launchpad.net/ppa-purge/ - but nowhere on that screen do I see any way to do that! It even says right there on the screen something about no files being associated with that page.

I thought, "Maybe it is already installed in Mint?" So I went to a terminal and typed it. No, it's not, but at least it told me that I can install it by typing something. So I did.

It tells me to install linux-source and linux-headers-generic. That part went okay.

It tells me to download driver from nVidia and to place the file into /home. I don't know what the person meant; sometimes I see that and it means /home. Other times I see it and it means my home directory, which ought to be written as /home/username but people don't for some reason which means that people like me who don't know tech and our ESP isn't so hot either have to flip a coin and hope we guessed correctly. I think I put it in my home directory. Well, actually it was in /home/username/Downloads so I copied it. Speaking of exercises in frustration, lol, I nearly gave up at that point because no matter how many times I held down CTRL, left-clicked-hold-down-button on the file, moved my cursor to the other directory, and let go... It wouldn't copy it! First it kept trying to select a bunch of files when I moved my cursor. I finally figured out that I had to click on the file as a separate action. Then hold down the CTRL button, left-click-and-hold on the file, and it would let me move the representation of it with my mouse cursor - only, you know, it wouldn't actually copy the thing(!!!ARGH!!!). So, finally, I treated it as a piece of text in Gedit; I right-clicked on the file, selected copy, then went to the directory where I wanted the copy, right-clicked, and... Oh, wait. First, I had to left-click on a blank spot because it kept assuming that I was wanting to do something to /home/username directory (the only entry in /home at that point). So... Intuitiveness, meet linux - and run, screaming, into the night. Okay, so I figured out to left-click on the open blank area. THEN I could right-click and select paste. It looks like I have successfully copied the file. I hope that I didn't just create a shortcut to it. To be honest, I don't know one way or the other - because the helpful directions just said to put it in /home. Well, I hope that I did; it looks like I did, I have two things in /home now: /username (my home(??? IDK why there are two different "home" definitions, it seems kind of important to know confused people are talking about with stuff like this, and I don't so I guess I'm left with just hoping that when I flipped that coin and tails appeared... that I was right when I read /home to be /home and not /home/username which if you ask me they'd have stated if that's what they meant, but... ARGH!!!!!!!!!!

So I copied the nvidia driver file. I think. Maybe. To the directory that the person meant in the directions. I think. Maybe.

It says to type sudo chmod a+x NVIDIA-file_name.run

I did so, but it didn't tell me anything, just gave me another prompt. Does that mean it did it? Or that it didn't do it? Usually if I type someone's directions into terminal and screw it up, it tells me something. But when I type someone's directions into terminal and DON'T screw it up... it tells me something. So... I... don't... know.

Then it says to boot into recovery console terminal thing. Okay there. I think. Maybe. It asked me for my password for maintainence. I didn't know if it meant if I gave it my password it would perform some sort of maintainence (what kind? Again, I don't have a CLUE because it doesn't say, it's speaking geek again!) - or if it meant that it would let ME perform some sort of maintainence. I... I guess that is what I am trying to do, sort of? So I hoped that was what it meant and typed in my password.

I think that's when I got a terminal prompt. So... that's good?

It says to type mount -o remount.rw /
into that terminal window. It gave me some text this time - but it was an error. Something about my partition is already mounted, I think. So I should have gave up and set my computer out for the trash man but it's not trash night so I kept on trying...

It says to type sudo nano /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.conf
and add line at end: blacklist nouveau
which I did. Then it says to save the file. It doesn't say how to do it. I finally figured out that I am supposed to use the CTRL button to get those menu(???) choices. Might have been helpful to include that little piece of secret knowledge for us regular people, but why start now, lofl? Anyway, I figured that one out on my own (finally). So I hit the CTRL button along with the letter for saving the file. Err... I think. It has an option for writeback or somesuch. The only thing computerese I ever heard like that is loopback. I don't think I want to mess with my wireless, so I hope they are not related. But it's got "write" in it, and that's the only place I see that. I don't see "save" anywhere. So I cross my fingers, my toes, my eyes... And try that.

At which point, the thing informs me that it's read-only.

But... I am playing the ROOT character in this frustrating game!!! Root cannot write files now? And I need to write this one.

There's even more directions in that post I linked the thread of up above^. But I have learned with linux that when you're trying to follow totally non-intuitive directions in an already non-intuitive OS, that continuing after you realize that the directions make errors only makes things worse instead of better.

Can't anyone help me with this? All I want to do is get a working OS on a working computer. You'd think that would happen automatically when a person sticks the DVD in, boots to it, and clicks install. I guess maybe I don't know the secrets. This is so frustrating I don't know how anyone ever even gets to the point where they can actually USE a computer because you have to already know this stuff to set one up in the frst place and how do you learn it if your computer won't work in the first place so you can use it to learn? It''s like some super-secret club, you can only get in if you know the handshake - and you can only learn the handshake in the club. ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (there should be 50 !s there, but I might have miscounted.)

It's too cold to keep squatting out here with my laptop sitting on a cinder block in my backyard. I will turn it off, stick it in a trash bag (it's snowing and I don't want it to get wet on top of everything else), and go inside and warm up for a few minutes. Hopefully, someone that understands that I didn't write the OS and therefore don't automatically know what people mean when they tell me something and are making assumptions that I automagically know what they mean(!!!!!)... Hopefully, someone like that will look at that thread post I keep mentioning, and translate it into English for me. And THAT'S if that post is even what I need to do in the first place - which I don't know to begin with. It's just a thread I found when I used Google to do a site-search (here) for nvidia 5200. (Trying to use this site's own search... ---***ARGH!!!!!***--- Yes, you guessed it, more frustration! Because when you type nvidia 5200 into the (literally) stupid thing, it decides that you didn't really want to search for nvidia 5200 and drops 5200 from your query. Do you know how many pages on this site have the term nvidia in them? A great many. Do you know how many have nvidia AND 5200 in them? No, me either, because the site CBA to do that particular search. Man... I need a nerve pill.

HELP!

Why is it SO INCREDIBLY HARD to do something so basic - and important? All I want to do is to make my graphics card work. Thing has been around for YEARS, you'd think someone would have figured it out by now. Actually, you'd think they'd simply include it in the kernel. But I suppose I should consider it lucky that they did not; they did that with the Broadcom 4311 driver and so now not only do we have to figure out how to install it anyway... We also have to figure out how to make the OS use it since it "knows" that it "works" already. Only, you know... It doesn't either. But that is fixed, I just need to fix my graphics card working. Just to play a simple game that's probably half as old as I am, to play a Youtube video that some twelve-year old probably made, that's not high technology is it? To play a video that is HERE, locally, no flashcrap required but that doesn't work EITHER. Netflix won't play. I haven't even bothered trying Hulu, like what's the point? I'm ready to cry now everything is BROKEN!

[MtnDewManiac]

Would it help if I reinstalled Mint 14 Xfce (32-bit)? Maybe I screwed up the process of getting the old 173(?) nVidia driver to work on my new OS, somehow, because I tried all the solutions I found one after the other (testing in between to see if whichever one I had just tried happened to work) - maybe by doing so I messed things up so that whichever way actually works could not work?

But I have basically not turned that computer on since giving up on being able to make it work and have, instead, just been doing basic web browsing (a few forums) and email on this laptop outside in the cold where it doesn't overheat. Only... It is now 58.3°F outside here and my laptop's CPU temperature is at 174°F, so I really do need to get my desktop working.

The good news is that, since it has been broken, I haven't done anything useful with it that would be lost if I reinstalled Mint.

It's an old (2002 I think) 32-bit AMD Athlon XP2200+, Abit NF7 motherboard, and AGP nVidia (type) FX5200 128 meg graphics card, BtW.

Thanks (much!) in advance,
MDM

[MtnDewManiac]

Okay, I have now reinstalled Mint Xfce 32-bit on the desktop. At this point, I have done nothing else to it. I did not wish to inadvertantly do something which could be a factor in the success/failure of installing the graphics driver series that I need.

The newest nVidia driver that works with my old FX5200 card is "173."

There is a recent (October, I believe) version of the 173 driver, 173.14.36, and I downloaded it (via another computer) to my USB flash drive. The release highlights note for this version states:

Added support for xserver ABI 13 (xorg-server 1.13).

Which I hope means that it can be made to work. I just do not know how and every step-by-step webpage that I have attempted to follow, either it isn't correct for both my older card and the newer distros - or I am just screwing up, somehow.

Also, I found this web page by searching:

Code: Select all

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-173/+bug/1064192

which links also to this one:

Code: Select all

https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/quantal/nvidia-graphics-drivers-173/quantal-proposed

I don't know if that helps, because I confess I just do not understand it. But it looks like the driver was updated specifically to deal with a compatibility issue with the newer distros - and that there is hope that it can be made to work with the Quantal (version? not sure of my terminology here) which I think is what Nadia is (?based on?).

Does this help?

BtW, I was sitting outside where it is still (for another week or two?) cold enough that I can use my laptop without it overheating, and my 71-year old mother stopped by. She asked what I was doing sitting outside besides shivering, lol, and after I explained that my laptop is failing, I showed her Mint 14 Xfce. For the first time ever, she did not immediately leave the computer! And it turns out that she likes the AisleRiot game "Thirteen," but more importantly, she seemed more comfortable than she ever has around a computer. This, I believe, is due to the OS/DE that I have installed on it. Thanks again, Clem! (And congratulations on doing what I previously thought to be impossible.)

Thank you very much in advance,
MDM

[anandrkris]

Since you're having issues in getting your graphics card to work, (even i had issues but thats a different mosnter called Nvidia Optimus), am sharing you few links of custom search engines that help in searching linux related topics. Hope it helps.

http://home.windstream.net/joelwest/
http://www.google.com/cse/home?cx=01760 ... _owgx6xyi0

Please don't take me wrong, but concise posts in forums will help is proper resolution of issues. Also, to post system specs, you could use the below command in Terminal.

Code: Select all

inxi -F

BTW, even am a big fan of supertuxkart game.

[ludude75]

I have been doing some testing of mint on some older pc's myself. Soyo board with Athlon XP 2000+ 1.66GHz and 1gb ddr ram.
I have 128 and 256mb FX5200 agp cards and both are unusable with mint 14 mate or cinnamon. Live cpu was at 100% Cinnamon would lock up at desktop screen, MATE I was lucky to get system monitor to work. Neither were usable.
Switched to a old asus 6600 agp card and cinnamon was very usable on it live with no other changes.

I read somewhere that if video card and or driver is not working cpu will try to make up for it.

I'd find a 7900,7800, 6800, 6600, 7600 nvidia card, nothing lower and shouldn't have as many issues.

[MtnDewManiac]

I have been doing some testing of mint on some older pc's myself. Soyo board with Athlon XP 2000+ 1.66GHz and 1gb ddr ram.
I have 128 and 256mb FX5200 agp card

Sounds like my desktop's setup, only it has an Abit NF7 motherboard.

s and both are unusable with mint 14 mate or cinnamon. Live cpu was at 100% Cinnamon would lock up at desktop screen, MATE I was lucky to get system monitor to work. Neither were usable.
Switched to a old asus 6600 agp card and cinnamon was very usable on it live with no other changes.

I read somewhere that if video card and or driver is not working cpu will try to make up for it.

If you mean that if it determines that you have no 3D acceleration, that the graphics will be done in software - and, therefore, turn your CPU into a somewhat inefficient heater - then I have read the same. Thought that was more a Cinnamon (and GNOME 3?) thing than a MATE one, though.

The thing is, the FX5200 has 3D acceleration. It's not "top-shelf" and would probably be ranked as poor by today's standards, of course - but it's there.

I believe that the trouble is... I guess a "knowledge of compatibleness" issue, if that makes any sense. The cards in question require the nvidia 173 series driver in order to work. At some point in the fairly recent past, it was no longer compatible with an xorg(?) component which was version 1.11 or so. nVidia released an updated driver that worked with version 1.11 (and v. 1.12 which was, by that time, in play). I think that updated driver was 173.14.35. Unfortunately, the xorg package that we are currently using (in Mint 14 and, I believe, in all setups which are based on Ubuntu 12.10) is 1.13.

Only... On October 4th, 2012, nVidia released an even newer (and current) 173 driver, 173.14.36, which was specifically released in order to address this issue - the release notes section states "Added support for xserver ABI 13 (xorg-server 1.13)." That means that our (Mint's) current version of the xorg package and the current version of the nVidia 173 graphics driver should work together.

But they don't. I do not know why. I read a thread somewhere that suggested it was a bug, although I do not know exactly what component the bug was supposed to be in. I got the impression that it was in the 173 driver package which had made it into Ubuntu's repository, but am unsure. It may be in the xorg package itself, possibly something as simple(?) as it checking to see which graphics driver is being used (well, attempted use ) and then deciding, "That one will not work." I just do not know.

I have thought about downloading the graphics driver straight from nVidia and attempting to install it, but in times/OS past I tried to do that and ruined my OS due to my incompetency . I never figured out the proper process of doing it and read enough threads that pretty much ended with "You'll screw it up, just grab the one from the repos" that I gave up.

If you feel like you might be able to install the driver that nVidia offers for download (please do - please, lol), here is the address that will take you directly to it:

Code: Select all

http://www.nvidia.com/object/linux-display-ia32-173.14.36-driver.html

I'd find a 7900,7800, 6800, 6600, 7600 nvidia card, nothing lower and shouldn't have as many issues.

Unfortunately, right now I am forced to use the equipment that I have available. I do not expect that to change in the foreseeable future unless I find something better in one of my dumpster-diving excursions. So far, no luck, although I did find a 19" Dell (4:3) monitor that seems to work okay except for some "cutting out" for a fraction of a second every minute or three and some cracking noises coming from inside it. As far as actually spending money, I'm afraid I'm concentrating on keeping my home and keeping the utilities turned on. What little (if any) that I have left over I offer to my mother and what she doesn't need (again, if any) I spend on food.

It kind of sucks (if I am allowed to use that term here?) because I have that desktop (hardware is fine, just not the latest and greatest), a laptop that has been loaned to me (which is even older and uses the open-source radeon driver, only I have not figured out how to configure it even though I have a set of options to adjust which will improve the graphics performance markedly), and a laptop which is not quite as old, has Intel 945(???)GMA(???) graphics that actually has usable graphics performance under Mint 14 as far as being able to view videos and streaming videos in full-screen mode without issues - but that the hardware is falling apart/failing on and can only be used at all for short periods of time and that outdoors in the cold (which is fast going away, since it is now officially Spring in my country).

Good luck with your old hardware! And if you ever figure it out, please return and post simple directions.

Best regards,
MDM

[palo]

There must be something that smells about those FX5xxx cards. I recently tried to setup a computer with FX5500 AGP just to stream movies on my TV. My experience is similar to yours (minus typing in the cold). First tried Xfce 13 - install went ok but flash performance was worse than usable. Different flash versions didn't help and several attempts at legacy NVIDIA drivers gave horrid results. Tried Cinnamon 13 and got 3D effects but only 3D effects. By that I mean there were nice shadows where windows were but no windows - title bar and window were missing - just dropshadows were there. Tried Manjaro Xfce and just got display garbage. Installed TinyXP and everything was fine - flash and all. So (and here's the part that makes me think it is more a problem with NVIDIA than Linux) I tried the old drivers from both NVIDIA and GEFORCE for that card while in XP and they failed to work. The only driver that would work properly was the MS certified driver supplied by MS labeled something like 5.3.1.6. Good luck on your quest.

Pat