LMDE Update Pack 7 - when?

[milamber]

+1 waiting for UP 7

[maxibuntu]

It's quite easy to point your repos to debian testing et voila, there is your update! Quite stable at the moment.

http://edos.debian.net/weather/

[GeneC]

Well I'd like to put in a comment, since I had been using LMDE since its first inception. I still run LMDE, but had given up on the Update Packs since shortly after their first usage. I have be tracking Debian Testing (what LMDE started its life doing). The UP's seemed a good idea at the time. The initial plan was for monthly updates but that never happened. There were several reasons for this. Namely upgrades to gnome (from 3.0 to 3.2 then to 3.4, et, et). Monthly UP's could still have been implemented, but there seems to have been more interest in developing Cinnamon and Mate in the Ubuntu based editions after the main LMDE developer left Mint. Perhaps not enough manpower nor interest in advancing LMDE. A shame as the 6 month release cycle of the Ubuntu base (way too often, bordering on ridiculous) was what drove me to LMDE in the first place.

I migrated on to a new Debian based distro that does successfully use monthly Update Packs, so it can be done. The developer is on its forums daily and addresses most all concerns in a timely fashion. It comes with KDE or XFCE desktops (both the most stable of the several Linux DE's), but most any others (Gnome, RazorQT, Cinnamon, Mate) could be installed by the end user with not much effort and help from other end users on the forums. Even its monthly UP's can consist of 200-300MB's. Its been 9 months since the last LMDE UP. What will the new UP size be? Several gigabytes? I don't see how this is feasible, perhaps it would be best for a new iso and a full new install (there the advantage of LMDE over the Main edition would be lost).

I still have an installation of LMDE but tracking Debian Testing. No issues. I get updates daily. I would like to see LMDE back to its roots and tracking Debian Testing, not on UP's. Mint doesn't have or wont allocate the resources for proper Update Packs. That is a shame.

[misGnomer]

Thanks Gene for the good nutshell explanation for the lack of UP updates with LMDE.

I'd still like to hear from Mint what their future plans for this project really are. Not having any dedicated (main) developer would certainly explain the way things stand.

I realize that it is poor form to "promote" alternative distros in any forum, but I must wonder whether a single clearly titled thread could (should?) be dedicated to such considerations under the circumstances.

I feel that the LMDE experiment (i.e. well-managed semi-rolling edition of Debian Testing) isn't withering due to lack of user interest though.

[maxibuntu]

Well I read some articles on SolydX and it seems to be a continuation of LMDE-XFCE. On the site of SolydXK I see that zerozero is one of the devs, and the software-center and updater are almost identical to the Mint version.

Why was this never communicated to the LMDE users? I would like some clear info on the matter.

I assume LMDE only focuses on Cinnamon and Mate now. Solyd seems like a fine distro if you use XFCE or KDE, so hop over to Solyd.

The default apps are VLC, Exaile, Abiword, Gnumeric, I'd rather use Gnome-player, Clementine, LibreOffice.

Update packs are released frequently however, and the UP's were the main reason for me to switch from Ubuntu. I might switch to SolydXK, but at the same time I'm rather tired of distro hopping.

I'm wondering how long SolydXK is gonna last. If only very few users are interested in the product, the enthousiasm of the devs will wear off and we users will probably find ourselves to be in the same no-update-packs situation two years from now.

Maybe It would be a better idea to just stick to debian testing proper, pick some extra mozilla repos, and write a script that makes a system backup and then updates the system through cron every month. To get it over with once and for all.

Or does such a script already exist?

[Bolle1961]

You can set the update interval to 2 weeks

[killer de bug]

The problem with Debian Testing is only with Cinnamon. You will shortly broke Cinnamon by using Testing.
But if you like XFCE, then it's the path to follow.

[maxibuntu]

You can set the update interval to 2 weeks

Ah well, is see there's lots of options: http://help.ubuntu.com/community/AutoWeeklyUpdateHowTo

[GeneC]

The problem with Debian Testing is only with Cinnamon. You will shortly broke Cinnamon by using Testing.
But if you like XFCE, then it's the path to follow.

Apologies, but that is not quite correct. I am on LMDE tracking Debian Testing with Cinnamon 1.8.8, Gnome-Shell 3.4, and XFCE 4.10 at the present...

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gene@lmde-cin ~ $ inxi -F
System:    Host: lmde-cin Kernel: 3.9-8.dmz.1-liquorix-amd64 x86_64 (64 bit) Desktop: Cinnamon 1.8.8  Distro: Linux Mint LMDE
Machine:   Mobo: ASUSTeK model: M4A88TD-M/USB3 version: Rev X.0x Bios: American Megatrends version: 1501 date: 08/09/2012
CPU:       Quad core AMD Phenom II X4 955 (-MCP-) cache: 2048 KB flags: (lm nx sse sse2 sse3 sse4a svm) 
           Clock Speeds: 1: 800.00 MHz 2: 3200.00 MHz 3: 800.00 MHz 4: 3200.00 MHz
Graphics:  Card: NVIDIA GF104 [GeForce GTX 460] X.Org: 1.12.4 driver: nvidia Resolution: 1680x1050@60.0hz 
           GLX Renderer: GeForce GTX 460/PCIe/SSE2 GLX Version: 4.3.0 NVIDIA 319.23
Audio:     Card-1: NVIDIA GF104 High Definition Audio Controller driver: snd_hda_intel 
           Card-2: Creative Labs CA0106 Soundblaster driver: snd_ca0106 
           Card-3: Advanced Micro Devices [AMD/ATI] SBx00 Azalia (Intel HDA) driver: snd_hda_intel 
           Sound: Advanced Linux Sound Architecture ver: k3.9-8.dmz.1-liquorix-amd64
Network:   Card: Realtek RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller driver: r8169 
           IF: eth1 state: up speed: 100 Mbps duplex: full mac: 48:5b:39:ee:b9:e7
Drives:    HDD Total Size: 750.2GB (0.7% used) 1: id: /dev/sda model: WDC_WD2500HHTZ size: 250.1GB 
           2: id: /dev/sdb model: HDS721050CLA362 size: 500.1GB 
Partition: ID: / size: 25G used: 5.2G (22%) fs: ext4 ID: swap-1 size: 2.10GB used: 0.00GB (0%) fs: swap 
Sensors:   System Temperatures: cpu: 40.0C mobo: 43.0C gpu: 62C 
           Fan Speeds (in rpm): cpu: 941 sys-1: 1591 
Info:      Processes: 166 Uptime: 1 min Memory: 395.0/11997.9MB Client: Shell (bash) inxi: 1.9.12 

[rimg]http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/7071/h42o.png[/rimg]

[maxibuntu]

I just converted LMDE into SolydX, to my relief it was a fairly easy process:

http://solydxk.com/community/tutorials/#lmdekde

It installs/removes:

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2013-08-12 19:33:09 install solydxk-keyring:all <none> 2013.02.17
2013-08-12 19:34:52 install lmdexfce-artwork:all <none> 2.0.0
2013-08-12 19:34:53 install lmdexfce-system-adjustments:all <none> 2.0.0
2013-08-12 19:37:39 startup packages remove
2013-08-12 19:37:40 remove console-common:all 0.7.87 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:40 remove mint-artwork-xfce:all 2012.07.10.1 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:41 remove mint-backgrounds-xfce:all 2012.06.21 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:42 remove mintupdate-debian:all 1.0.6 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:42 remove mintsystem:all 7.8.3 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:43 remove mint-debian-mirrors:all 2013.02.18 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:44 remove mint-info-debian-xfce:i386 2012.09.12 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:44 remove mint-themes:all 1.0.8 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:45 remove mint-x-icons:all 1.1.1 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:47 remove mintinstall:all 7.4.4 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:48 remove mintinstall-icons:all 1.0.7 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:51 remove mint-common:all 1.0.9 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:51 remove mint-translations:all 2013.04.11 <none>
2013-08-12 19:37:58 install gtk2-engines-oxygen:i386 <none> 1.3.3-2
2013-08-12 19:38:00 install gtk3-engines-oxygen:i386 <none> 1.1.4-1
2013-08-12 19:38:00 install libkms1:i386 <none> 2.4.45-3
2013-08-12 19:38:01 install plymouth:i386 <none> 0.8.8-10
2013-08-12 19:38:02 install plymouth-drm:i386 <none> 0.8.8-10
2013-08-12 19:38:02 install solydx-artwork:all <none> 1.0.3
2013-08-12 19:38:05 install plymouth-x11:i386 <none> 0.8.8-10
2013-08-12 19:38:06 install debian-plymouth-manager:all <none> 2.1.2
2013-08-12 19:38:07 install gtk2-engines-pixbuf:i386 <none> 2.24.20-1
2013-08-12 19:38:08 install oxygencursors:all <none> 0.0.2012-06-kde4.8-2.1
2013-08-12 19:38:09 install plymouth-themes-solydx:all <none> 1.0.1
2013-08-12 19:38:10 install solydx-grub2-theme:all <none> 1.0.1
2013-08-12 19:38:11 install solydx-info:i386 <none> 1.0.2
2013-08-12 19:38:12 install solydx-lightdm-adjustments:all <none> 1.0.1
2013-08-12 19:38:14 install solydxk-system:all <none> 1.0.8
2013-08-12 19:38:14 install solydx-system-adjustments:all <none> 1.0.9
2013-08-12 19:38:16 install solydxk-flashplugin-11:i386 <none> 11.2.202.297
2013-08-12 19:38:19 install solydxk-softwaremanager:all <none> 7.5.3
2013-08-12 19:38:22 install solydxk-sws:all <none> 0.6.1
2013-08-12 19:38:23 install updatemanager:all <none> 1.2.9
2013-08-12 19:38:25 install solydx-meta:all <none> 2013.03.22

It hosed some custom backgrounds and themes.

Be sure to backup /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf and your /etc/apt/sources list.

It installs a grub background which you can disable by removing package solydx-grub2-theme.

/etc/bash.bashrc is renamed to /etc/bash.bashrc.divert and that messed up my root prompt.

The mint-update is now called updatemanager. The location of the update manager config files has oddly changed to /etc/linuxmint to /usr/lib/solydxk/updatemanager.

If you have a list of ingored packages you should update your config:

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mv /etc/linuxmint/mintupdate.ignored /usr/lib/solydxk/updatemanager/updatemanager.ignored

I removed these packages cause I don't need them:

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2013-08-12 20:22:22 remove debian-plymouth-manager:all 2.1.2 <none>
2013-08-12 20:22:24 remove plymouth-x11:i386 0.8.8-10 <none>
2013-08-12 20:22:25 remove plymouth-themes-solydx:all 1.0.1 <none>
2013-08-12 20:22:28 remove plymouth-drm:i386 0.8.8-10 <none>
2013-08-12 20:22:30 remove plymouth:i386 0.8.8-10 <none>
2013-08-12 20:22:32 remove solydx-grub2-theme:all 1.0.1 <none>
2013-08-12 20:22:33 remove solydx-lightdm-adjustments:all 1.0.1 <none>

The best thing is that it pulls in a lot of multimedia updates. Clearly the LMDE repos are lagging behind:

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2013-08-12 19:39:57 status installed libc-bin:i386 2.17-92
2013-08-12 19:47:58 status installed libavutil52:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:47:58 status installed libfdk-aac0:i386 1:0.1.1-dmo3
2013-08-12 19:47:58 status installed libmp3lame0:i386 1:3.99.5-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:47:59 status installed libx264-135:i386 3:0.135.2345+gitf0c1c53-dmo1
2013-08-12 19:47:59 status installed libavcodec54:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:48:00 status installed libavformat54:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:48:00 status installed libpostproc52:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:48:00 status installed libswresample0:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:48:01 status installed libswscale2:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:48:01 status installed libavfilter3:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:48:01 status installed libavdevice54:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:48:02 status installed libavutil51:i386 8:1.0.7-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:03 status installed libdca0:i386 0.0.5-dmo1
2013-08-12 19:48:03 status installed libdvdcss2:i386 1.2.13-dmo1
2013-08-12 19:48:03 status installed libvamp-hostsdk3:i386 2.5-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:03 status installed avidemux-plugins:i386 1:2.5.6-dmo8
2013-08-12 19:48:03 status installed avidemux-common:all 1:2.5.6-dmo8
2013-08-12 19:48:04 status installed avidemux:i386 1:2.5.6-dmo8
2013-08-12 19:48:06 status installed avidemux-cli:i386 1:2.5.6-dmo8
2013-08-12 19:48:06 status installed bombono-dvd-data:all 1:1.2.2-dmo1
2013-08-12 19:48:07 status installed ffmpeg:i386 9:1.2.1-dmo6
2013-08-12 19:48:07 status installed bombono-dvd:i386 1:1.2.2-dmo1
2013-08-12 19:48:08 status installed lame:i386 1:3.99.5-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:08 status installed libmlt-data:all 1:0.9.0-dmo3
2013-08-12 19:48:08 status installed vlc-data:all 1:2.0.7-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:09 status installed libvlccore5:i386 1:2.0.7-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:09 status installed libvlc5:i386 1:2.0.7-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:09 status installed nvidia-detect:i386 319.17-1
2013-08-12 19:48:09 status installed vlc-nox:i386 1:2.0.7-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:09 status installed vlc-plugin-pulse:i386 1:2.0.7-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:10 status installed vlc:i386 1:2.0.7-dmo2
2013-08-12 19:48:10 status installed handbrake-cli:i386 0.9.9-dmo3
2013-08-12 19:48:10 status installed handbrake-gtk:i386 0.9.9-dmo3
2013-08-12 19:48:10 status installed mencoder:i386 3:1.1.1-dmo4
2013-08-12 19:48:11 status installed mplayer:i386 3:1.1.1-dmo4
2013-08-12 19:48:11 status installed mplayer-nogui:i386 3:1.1.1-dmo4

[palimmo]

no news about the up7?

[excollier]

I just installed SolydX on a spare hdd, looks pretty good while feeling very familliar to my LMDE install, trouble is it needs 450MB of updates! Takes a while on a slow download connection.

[killer de bug]

Clem should normally release a monthly news in a few days. If he don't speak about LMDE and UP7, then we will all know that LMDE is dead...

[excollier]

I think I will jump to SolydX/K and ditch LMDE. The UP is likely gonna be huge and it takes me hours to download an average (1GB) iso so the next UP will take me days probably.
I like LMDE but it will be nice to have more frequent, smaller UPs for what is essentially the same system.
I will carry on with regular Linux Mint on my other partitions though, I am waiting for 17 so I can put a stop to downloading iso image files for a few years. That was the plan for using LMDE, but unfortunately it hasn't worked that way.

[kurotsugi]

if the UP size is your main concern then following testing is a better option. you can maintain your system daily/weekly with smaller package download. you can use clonezilla to create a 'save point' between your your updates. if you're using cinnamon then you should hold gjs package since newer version will kill your cinnamon.

[killer de bug]

Apologies, but that is not quite correct. I am on LMDE tracking Debian Testing with Cinnamon 1.8.8, Gnome-Shell 3.4, and XFCE 4.10 at the present...

Testing users reported problem with gjs today
But yes I understand that until Gnome 3.8 is pushed in testing, Cinnamon should work. But it seems already no more true.

Testing has the new 3.10 kernel... omg... Why do I still have a 3.2

[GeneC]

Yes... I spoke too soon...
One day after I said all was fine it breaks....

[excollier]

if the UP size is your main concern then following testing is a better option. you can maintain your system daily/weekly with smaller package download. you can use clonezilla to create a 'save point' between your your updates. if you're using cinnamon then you should hold gjs package since newer version will kill your cinnamon.

Nah, I couldn't be bothered with the constant maintenance of testing and frequent breakages. Life's too short.
I installed and updated SolydX and then added KDE to it to give a DE option at boot. It's impressive.

[pjc123]

I am also debating whether to bail out of LMDE. It would have worked out great for what I wanted, a nice blend of stability and updates, but the updates are just taking way too long. Monthly updates would have been perfect. Heck, we are approaching bi-annually issued updates.

[excollier]

I should add that I installed SolydX on a separate hdd, I still have LMDE on my main hdd, hoping it will be sorted.