Linux MInt 13 and Ubuntu 12.04.4 update

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jaws222
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Linux MInt 13 and Ubuntu 12.04.4 update

Post by jaws222 » Wed Feb 05, 2014 10:50 am

Will Mint 13 also have an option for the latest Ubuntu (12.04.4) update?

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karlchen
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Re: Linux MInt 13 and Ubuntu 12.04.4 update

Post by karlchen » Wed Feb 05, 2014 12:59 pm

Hello, jaws222.

Which software packages / which updates in particular do you have in mind or on your screen?
Basically, Mint 13 should be able to receive the same updates as Ubuntu 12.04.4. Which ones will really be offered for intstallation to you depends on which software packages are present on your system and on which safety levels you have activated in mintUpdate.

Code: Select all

$ uname -a; lsb_release -rd; cat /etc/os-release 
Linux machname 3.5.0-45-generic #68~precise1-Ubuntu SMP Wed Dec 4 16:19:28 UTC 2013 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux
Description:	Linux Mint 13 Maya
Release:	13
NAME="Ubuntu"
VERSION="12.04.4 LTS, Precise Pangolin"
ID=ubuntu
ID_LIKE=debian
PRETTY_NAME="Ubuntu precise (12.04.4 LTS)"
VERSION_ID="12.04"
This is from the machine where I am typing this reply. Mint 13. Kernel 3.5.0-45#68 (kernel series backported from Quantal Quetzal). From the Ubuntu perspective this is a Ubuntu 12.04.4.

Kind regards,
Karl
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Ubuntu 18.04.2 32-bit Mate Desktop, Total Commander 9.22a 32-bit
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jaws222
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Re: Linux MInt 13 and Ubuntu 12.04.4 update

Post by jaws222 » Wed Feb 05, 2014 1:26 pm

karlchen wrote:Hello, jaws222.

Which software packages / which updates in particular do you have in mind or on your screen?
Basically, Mint 13 should be able to receive the same updates as Ubuntu 12.04.4. Which ones will really be offered for intstallation to you depends on which software packages are present on your system and on which safety levels you have activated in mintUpdate.

Code: Select all

$ uname -a; lsb_release -rd; cat /etc/os-release 
Linux machname 3.5.0-45-generic #68~precise1-Ubuntu SMP Wed Dec 4 16:19:28 UTC 2013 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux
Description: Linux Mint 13 Maya
Release: 13
NAME="Ubuntu"
VERSION="12.04.4 LTS, Precise Pangolin"
ID=ubuntu
ID_LIKE=debian
PRETTY_NAME="Ubuntu precise (12.04.4 LTS)"
VERSION_ID="12.04"
This is from the machine where I am typing this reply. Mint 13. Kernel 3.5.0-45#68 (kernel series backported from Quantal Quetzal). From the Ubuntu perspective this is a Ubuntu 12.04.4.

Kind regards,
Karl

Thanks for your reply. I was looking to see if it was a total update just like it would occur for Ubuntu. I did notice in the Ubuntu 12.04 update notes that they were going to kernel 3.11. I know I can go ahead and update the kernel on my own, but I have an AMD graphics card and I'll have to deal with reinstalling that. I figured with the 12.04.4 update it might be a lot smoother.

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karlchen
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Re: Linux MInt 13 and Ubuntu 12.04.4 update

Post by karlchen » Wed Feb 05, 2014 5:49 pm

Hello, jaws222.

I think there is a misunderstanding with respect to kernel updates on Ubuntu 12.04:
  • Ubuntu 12.04 Precise Pangolin and kernel series
    • The original Ubuntu 12.04 came with the kernel series 3.2.0-xx. This kernel receives bugfixes and security updates till today. But users who started with Ubuntu 12.04 (no service pack) will not be offered to upgrade their kernel K3.2.0-xx to one of the later kernel series, K3.5.0-xx, 3.8.0-xx or 3.11.0-xx.
    • When Ubuntu had advanced to 12.04.2 (service pack 2), new installation ISO images were published which brought along kernel 3.5.0-xx. Users who installed Ubuntu 12.04.2 from these ISO images got kernel K3.5.0-xx. This kernel receives bugfixes and security updates till today. But users who started with Ubuntu 12.04.2 will not be offered to upgrade their kernel K3.5.0-xx to one of the later kernel series, K3.8.0-xx or 3.11.0-xx.
    • When Ubuntu had advanced to 12.04.3 (service pack 3), new installation ISO images were published which brought along kernel 3.8.0-xx. Users who installed Ubuntu 12.04.3 from these ISO images got kernel K3.8.0-xx. This kernel receives bugfixes and security updates till today. But users who started with Ubuntu 12.04.3 will not be offered to upgrade their kernel K3.8.0-xx to K3.11.0-xx.
    • By now Ubuntu has advanced to 12.04.4 (service pack 4). New installation ISO images have been published which bring along kernel 3.11.0-xx. This kernel again receives bugfixes and security patches.
    • Essence:
      Each Ubuntu user will be offered updates for the kernel series which came with the Ubuntu 12.04 release that they initially installed.
      If a Ubuntu user wants to switch from an older kernel series to a newer kernel series, they will have to follow the procedure laid out on this Ubuntu webpage: Latest Hardware Enablement Stack.
  • Linux Mint 13 kernel series
    • Linux Mint 13 was released shortly after Ubuntu 12.04. Therefore Linux Mint 13 brings along kernel k3.2.0-xx.
    • Linux Mint 13 has never been advanced to any service pack level. In particular the installation ISO images have never been updated to include the Ubuntu 12.04 service pack changes.
    • As a consequence Linux Mint 13 is tied to kernel K3.2.0-xx.
    • Essence:
      Each Mint 13 user will be offered updates for the kernel series K3.2.0-xx.
      If a Mint 13 user wants to switch from the old kernel series K3.2.0-xx to a newer kernel series, they will have to follow the procedure laid out on this Ubuntu webpage: Latest Hardware Enablement Stack.
  • Service Pack Level and Kernel Series
    As a consequence of what has been explained above, my Mint 13 running on a K3.5.0-xx kernel all the time, received all the other Ubuntu updates nonetheless which promoted it from no service pack to SP2, SP3 and a few days ago to SP4.
    Installing all Ubuntu updates which are offered will not automatically upgrade an installed kernel to a newer kernel series.
Potential Consequence for You:
In case it is true that kernel series K3.11.0-xx supports AMD graphics cards much better than previous kernel series, it may be advisable to install the latest Latest Hardware Enablement Stack. on Mint 13 which Ubuntu can offer you.
I had to upgrade to K3.5.0-xx right after installing Mint 13 on a Dell notebook in this way, because K3.2.0-xx was affected by a bug which would cause hard hangs on particular hardware. And the Dell notebook had got this hardware.

Cheers,
Karl
Image
Linux Mint 18.1 64-bit Cinnamon Desktop, Total Commander 9.22a 64-bit
Ubuntu 18.04.2 32-bit Mate Desktop, Total Commander 9.22a 32-bit
Windows? - 1 window in every room

jaws222
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Re: Linux MInt 13 and Ubuntu 12.04.4 update

Post by jaws222 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:51 am

karlchen wrote:Hello, jaws222.

I think there is a misunderstanding with respect to kernel updates on Ubuntu 12.04:
  • Ubuntu 12.04 Precise Pangolin and kernel series
    • The original Ubuntu 12.04 came with the kernel series 3.2.0-xx. This kernel receives bugfixes and security updates till today. But users who started with Ubuntu 12.04 (no service pack) will not be offered to upgrade their kernel K3.2.0-xx to one of the later kernel series, K3.5.0-xx, 3.8.0-xx or 3.11.0-xx.
    • When Ubuntu had advanced to 12.04.2 (service pack 2), new installation ISO images were published which brought along kernel 3.5.0-xx. Users who installed Ubuntu 12.04.2 from these ISO images got kernel K3.5.0-xx. This kernel receives bugfixes and security updates till today. But users who started with Ubuntu 12.04.2 will not be offered to upgrade their kernel K3.5.0-xx to one of the later kernel series, K3.8.0-xx or 3.11.0-xx.
    • When Ubuntu had advanced to 12.04.3 (service pack 3), new installation ISO images were published which brought along kernel 3.8.0-xx. Users who installed Ubuntu 12.04.3 from these ISO images got kernel K3.8.0-xx. This kernel receives bugfixes and security updates till today. But users who started with Ubuntu 12.04.3 will not be offered to upgrade their kernel K3.8.0-xx to K3.11.0-xx.
    • By now Ubuntu has advanced to 12.04.4 (service pack 4). New installation ISO images have been published which bring along kernel 3.11.0-xx. This kernel again receives bugfixes and security patches.
    • Essence:
      Each Ubuntu user will be offered updates for the kernel series which came with the Ubuntu 12.04 release that they initially installed.
      If a Ubuntu user wants to switch from an older kernel series to a newer kernel series, they will have to follow the procedure laid out on this Ubuntu webpage: Latest Hardware Enablement Stack.
  • Linux Mint 13 kernel series
    • Linux Mint 13 was released shortly after Ubuntu 12.04. Therefore Linux Mint 13 brings along kernel k3.2.0-xx.
    • Linux Mint 13 has never been advanced to any service pack level. In particular the installation ISO images have never been updated to include the Ubuntu 12.04 service pack changes.
    • As a consequence Linux Mint 13 is tied to kernel K3.2.0-xx.
    • Essence:
      Each Mint 13 user will be offered updates for the kernel series K3.2.0-xx.
      If a Mint 13 user wants to switch from the old kernel series K3.2.0-xx to a newer kernel series, they will have to follow the procedure laid out on this Ubuntu webpage: Latest Hardware Enablement Stack.
  • Service Pack Level and Kernel Series
    As a consequence of what has been explained above, my Mint 13 running on a K3.5.0-xx kernel all the time, received all the other Ubuntu updates nonetheless which promoted it from no service pack to SP2, SP3 and a few days ago to SP4.
    Installing all Ubuntu updates which are offered will not automatically upgrade an installed kernel to a newer kernel series.
Potential Consequence for You:
In case it is true that kernel series K3.11.0-xx supports AMD graphics cards much better than previous kernel series, it may be advisable to install the latest Latest Hardware Enablement Stack. on Mint 13 which Ubuntu can offer you.
I had to upgrade to K3.5.0-xx right after installing Mint 13 on a Dell notebook in this way, because K3.2.0-xx was affected by a bug which would cause hard hangs on particular hardware. And the Dell notebook had got this hardware.

Cheers,
Karl


WOW! That's a lot of information. Thanks for that. I was more interested in the kernel update. I had an installation of Linux Mint 15 on another computer and I followed the upgrade process to get the 3.10 kernel installed after it went gold. It broke my Nvidia, so I went with the Noveau driver. Unfortunately, at the time I was trying to configure 3 monitors 2-19inch and a 37 inch TV through a USB Displaylink adapter. I got it to show all 3 screens but the performance was horrendous.

I'm trying something similar in another room with the AMD driver, a 22 inch monitor, a 24 inch monitor and a 42 inch tv. They all work perfectly on Windows 7 and I thought maybe the 3.11 would be improved. I have a multiboot system with Windows 7 / Linux MInt 13. I keep the two operating systems on separate drives. I mostly use Linux Mint (because it's a better system of course) and would like to get the 3 monitors working and not use Windows at all. I'll weigh my options and see if it's worth it. My other alternative is to wait for Mint 17 and give that a go. Thanks again for your input.

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karlchen
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Re: Linux MInt 13 and Ubuntu 12.04.4 update

Post by karlchen » Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:11 am

Hello, jaws222.

OK, in case "kernel update" to you means e.g. having kernel 3.2.0-53 and updating this to kernel 3.2.0-58: this is possible on Mint 13 without much hassle: Inside MintUpdate make the updates of safety categories 4 and 5 visible and declare them "safe for installation". You will be offered the latest kernel which is available for the K3.2.0 series for installation. Install it. Reboot and be happy. (Hopefully)

In case, however, "kernel update" to you also includes switching from the original kernel series K3.2.0-xx to a more recent kernel series K3.5.0-xx or K3.11.0-xx, in this case such a switch has to be initiated manually and when switching to a newer kernel series, this should always involve switching to a newer hardware enablement stack.
There is a close relationship between a kernel series (3.2.0, 3.5.0, 3.11.0) and the hardware support software that it brings along and that it will expect to be present.

This is what the "hardware enablement" articles which I pointed to explain.

Cheers,
Karl
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Linux Mint 18.1 64-bit Cinnamon Desktop, Total Commander 9.22a 64-bit
Ubuntu 18.04.2 32-bit Mate Desktop, Total Commander 9.22a 32-bit
Windows? - 1 window in every room

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