reason many will never want Linux in general.

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donec
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reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by donec »

It's true that Windows has problems with viruses and crashes and such. However! Many people are aware of this and expect it and know what to do when it does happen nothing new. Now Linux distro's in general don't crash or have virus problems, They are secure and stable, but they don't have consistency. Meaning that a Linux user will always need to be expecting something new every 6 months or so because the peer satisfaction that has caused the distro wars drives developers to keep providing new changes or the distro dies. This is something that will keep a lot of users from being happy with Linux. They would rather deal with fixing known problems over and over again instead of learning the new stuff and implementing it.
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MagnusB
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by MagnusB »

Phosgene wrote:True, despite how user friendly linux can be, I would still recommend Windows to most people who just want to do standard things like use office, browse the internet and listen to music.
I beg to differ. If anyone wants the computer connected to the internet, I recommend Linux. If you have more specialized needs, like a certain commercial software, I would recommend Windooze. Seriously, for just being on the internet, word processing and general multimedia usage, Linux is so much better, and far more stable.

And you don't have to update every six months, in fact you don't don't really have to update at all. Once you got it running, nobody forces you to run the latest and greatest, being on the bleeding edge is just going to result in an unstable system.
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lakehousetech
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by lakehousetech »

Linux is perfect for users that just want to surf the net and do word processing.....very simple tasks, but just as perfect for the power user. One of the killer show stoppers is still WiFi hardware support. It's getting better, but many novices don't want to mess with making them work....especially the Broadcom cards. Also gaming is still crummy. That's one of the few reasons I need to dual boot XP with Mint. I have to admit though that I have enjoyed playing around with Sauerbraten via the portal.
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by Lantesh »

Windows is not inherently easier for the common user. It only seems to be easier, because that is what people are familiar with. For example my two nieces, age 9 and 12, are using Edubuntu. They do not have years of Windows experience like the average user, and this has proven to be a huge benefit. They don't have any preconceived ideas on how things are supposed to work, and therefore readily accept Linux for what it is. In fact I'm in the process of building them their own PC (they have been using mine) and the 9 year old's main concern was that it's still going to have Tux Paint and SuperTux. She couldn't care less about Windows.
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by lakehousetech »

Funny that you mentioned that. Very true. I frankenstein'd an old computer together for my friends mom who runs a day care. At the time Cassandra was out, so I put that on and they love it. It's been solid as a rock since I gave it to them, and the kids have no trouble playing games and playing around on it.
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Dutchmaster
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by Dutchmaster »

My evidence of Linux' ability to do just fine with the average user is my wife. Browsing, music, video, email. No more-no less.

With Windows it was non-stop griping and moaning about how this or that wouldn't work for her. Constant.

That's why I sought Linux 5+ years ago. Since then, I've had almost zero complaints. I can't think of any examples in a long time, but to be safe let's say a few at most.

'Cause if Mama's happy..... everybody's happy etc. :wink: Good ole Linux marital therapy. 8)
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Katzedecimal
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by Katzedecimal »

I have to agree with Lantesh and Dutchmaster, it depends on how one defines "easier." For the "average user" (ie Joe/Jane Rube), the one and only thing that makes Windows "easier" is that if something pooches up, he can take it to any fixit shop. To find a fixit shop that speaks Linux, he has to hit the yellow pages - or else learn to fix it himself, which Joe/Jane Rube typically does not want to do.

But Windows is not "easier" when it comes to setting it up, getting it going, installing and uninstalling programs or hardware, or just understanding how the darned thing works. Once the hardware situation got complicated (LANs and layered networking, etc) and Windows started 'managing' program installs like dropping bags of popcorn, it got a lot more challenging to keep up.

If Ubuntu grows in popularity, it may become easier to find fixit shops that speak Linux, but for now (at least in my area), if you want to run a Linux box, you've got to learn some Linux, because something is going to pooch up sooner or later. That's why it probably won't catch on with Joe Average User, and why I don't try to convince everyone I know to switch over when I'm fangirling about Mint. My reasons for wanting Linux include the usual "want to be free from M$ DavrOS and its box-raping minions", but the most important one is "When my Best Beloved dies, I'm hooped." I want to learn to control my OS and my comp again, I don't want to rely on the fixit shops. Getting it up and running may require an expert or a distro like Mint or PCLOS (not so much 'user-friendly' as 'n00b who wants to get their feet in the water'-friendly) but once in, I find Linux is easier to understand and learn how to work with, and by 'work with' I mean the nitty-gritty stuff like getting integrated onto the household LAN, not just loading a playlist into Rhythmbox. I've learned more about how my system works in the last 4 - 5 weeks than in the last 8 years of Windows XP, despite Linux's rep for having a steep learning-curve.
"Dance without sleeping, I'll dance without fear
Dance without senses, no message I hear
Dance without feeling, I'll dance 'til I'm numb
Dance 'til I think I can overcome" -- Melissa Etheridge
lakehousetech
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by lakehousetech »

Didn't Melissa Etheridge get hit by a truck or something?
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Katzedecimal
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by Katzedecimal »

Point to that question being....? :roll:
"Dance without sleeping, I'll dance without fear
Dance without senses, no message I hear
Dance without feeling, I'll dance 'til I'm numb
Dance 'til I think I can overcome" -- Melissa Etheridge
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by lakehousetech »

Pure curiosity. I thought she died a couple years ago. Just looking for some confirmation....that's all. So did she or didn't she?
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by Katzedecimal »

Couldn't tell you. I'm not a rabid fan, only like that one song because it fits my philosophy of life. Wiki? Google?
"Dance without sleeping, I'll dance without fear
Dance without senses, no message I hear
Dance without feeling, I'll dance 'til I'm numb
Dance 'til I think I can overcome" -- Melissa Etheridge
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by LinuxForever »

If a person doesn't like linux I'd recommend the Mac. If I don't like the person I'd recommend windblowz. :lol:
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by lakehousetech »

I just read a recent article that talked about how enterprise IT is still avoiding Vista like the plague. No wonder that MS had to lengthen XP support to 2014. What I also read is that the upcoming Windows 7 is basically Vista with 'improvements'. If MS keeps this up they are going to be in a world of hurt.
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by LinuxForever »

lakehousetech Melissa is alive and well. Melissa Etheridge http://www.melissaetheridge.com/home/
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by Tithis »

As I recall there were far fewer changes going to the next version of Mint then there were going from XP to Vista. Also like stated before nobody can force you to upgrade.
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by SAHChandler »

Alright, I don't want to be rude here, so please take what I say with a grain of salt (also realize I have a terrible sense of humor so you may have to read between the lines) and realize it is merely opinion and I'm not going to force it on anybody.
For me, open Source means freedom of choice (Not just speech). And whether that means Proprietary software or free software, is up to you. Ain't nobody that can stop you (or correct you on your grammar XD). Except Richard Stallman if he were to punch you...or something I don't know.

Now as a programmer I find Linux a hell of a lot cooler. I seriously feel like I am in more control of the operating System, than when I was running windows.
Phoseghene spoke of how they would recommend windows to anyone who wanted to run word prcoessing or internet browsing and whatnot. I however would not and recommend Linux, because that person shouldn't have to worry about virus', programming, or anything that as an advanced user, we are used to on a regular basis. And you know, yes, Linux is a curiousity. Would you have ever thought anything about Linux if you hadn't ever heard of it? Probably not.

Also real quick before I continue, there's a lot of people out there working for microsoft because they need to feed themselves, (and I don't mean to offend Clem, BUT) I'm pretty sure developing Linux really doesn't pay the bills alone. Unless your name is Mark Shuttleworth. Or you are running a foundation called the FSF. So to insult is to insult a bunch of people who went to college and just LOVE developing software. it really isn't fair to them. Just like it wouldn't be fair to call you all sheep to the Open Source Initivative (I AM NOT CALLING YOU THIS. It is merely an Example), so to keep calling it windoze or windooze or windblows or whatever, would be like calling you a sheep. Seriously. it doesn't give you the right to act all high and mighty and to insult someone's beliefs (All right so it's a "god given right" or whatever, but still a little courtesy never killed anyone. Except you know... people in duels. And whatnot.)

And i'm not going to lie here. OpenGL is a steaming pile of poo. Seriously. I was waiting for the Object Oriented update with 3.0. Did we get it? No. Honestly if there were a truly open version of DirectX 9.0c I would use it faster than you can say "./configure".

Don't get me wrong while I may be pointing out a few of the flaws I see and experience on a regular basis with Linux, I want to support this platform as much as I possibly can, as well as the other ones, because it just isn't fair to cut people out of all the fun.. If I could SVN update my left arm and right foot I would. But I can't, because you know I don't think limbs would be awesome to host on a server. If I could afford it somehow I would startup a console to challenge Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft. I mean we have the OpenMoko, why can't we have the OpenConsole?

I guess at this point I'm ranting to I think I should stop. But again, please don't take offense, this is my own personal opinion written in my personal style.
I hope I may have amused you in some way. But also seriously THINK about what I've said, and don't outight dismiss me. Even if I am missing a few details, here and there (XD)
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Post by Martin Rabson »

test test
Last edited by Martin Rabson on Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by exploder »

I think regressions and the inability to upgrade some packages is a show stopper for some. Graphics cards that work fine in one release do not work in another and things people want like Firefox updates are a mess with a Ubuntu base. I have always thought that it would make more sense to fix all of the bugs in any given release before building a new one. The problem is with the various states of development of individual projects. For those of us that choose Linux as our operating system of choice there will always be something that we have to fix ourselves.
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by rhY »

Windows is only better for two things: Games. Legacy Apps. Other than that, Mint is more reliable, less bloated, has a nicer GUI..... The only thing keeping Windows up is hegemony.
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Re: reason many will never want Linux in general.

Post by DrHu »

SAHChandler wrote:And i'm not going to lie here. OpenGL is a steaming pile of poo. Seriously. I was waiting for the Object Oriented update with 3.0. Did we get it? No. Honestly if there were a truly open version of DirectX 9.0c I would use it faster than you can say "./configure".
I agree about the "winblows" commentaries, not necessary at all, doesn't prove a thing!

Honestly if there were a truly open version of DirectX 9.0c
Honestly, Microsoft will never allow that to happen; if anyone got close
http://alkyproject.blogspot.com/
  • Lastly, we have nothing definitive to report in regards to our support for DirectX 10 based games. As announced in the very beginning, this is a monumental effort and will take a great deal of time to implement properly. We hope to have a fully functioning demo in two months or so
--one patient: the Alky project didn't survive, not surprising considering the amount of cash it would take to prove the software

And i'm not going to lie here. OpenGL is a steaming pile of poo.
I can't agree with that description..
http://newsletters.hagerman.com/newslet ... l60-WP.htm
--it the market force at work, not the underlying technology that apparently mattered most!

http://windowsitpro.com/article/article ... -back.html
  • Microsoft claimed that GLQuake ran 1 Frame Per Second (FPS) slower with the DirectX 5.0 version of Direct3D than the original GLQuake on a 3Dfx card (this is the card most GLQuake players use). However, using the nvidia RIVA 128 chip, it runs 1 FPS faster.
--I didn't realize 1FPS was so significant!
  • Id CEO Todd Hollenshead is also upset with Microsoft's demonstration.
    "One of the oldest 'spin-doctor' tricks in the books is 'when you can't beat your opponent's argument, simply change the subject.' This is exactly what Microsoft has done in the publicity concerning their conference. It is clearly an attempt to dupe the public and undermine Carmack's credibility by having an 'intern' work on the D3D conversion and then crow about FPS performance while using incomparable hardware.
--that style never ends (that's what does blow about Microsoft..)
I am sure they improved since this directX 3d (1997), but Microsoft does have some OpenGL patents, maybe they thought there was something to it..
http://windowsitpro.com/article/article ... -mind.html
  • In June, id's John Carmack and John Romero (creators of DOOM, DOOM II, Quake, and other hit games) were among the leading games developers that signed an open letter to Microsoft begging them to develop OpenGL as a standard Windows 95/NT API for 3D games development. The developers explained that Direct3D, the 3D component of DirectX, was a miserable hack and was very much inferior to OpenGL
--same era, crushing the competition, in this case their own employee..

DirectX history..
http://wapedia.mobi/en/DxDiag
http://news.oreilly.com/2008/08/opengl- ... to-fa.html
  • Khronos recently posted an announcement of the long-awaited OpenGL 3.0 specification. Roland Wolters's analysis of the OpenGL 3.0 release is insightful. In particular, an oft-cited comparison is to Microsoft's Direct3D. One theory explains that developers will choose the Direct3D API over OpenGL 3.0, because the former offers more and better features.

    That theory is right in some ways, but it's wrong in more important ways.

    It's right in that choosing Direct3D is an option over OpenGL for Windows applications and XBox games. It's wrong in that Direct3D isn't an option for (most? all?) non-Windows platforms. If you want to use 3D features in a non-Windows, non-XBox program, you either program the card itself directly, or you use OpenGL. It's more or less your only option. (For the wags in the audience, Wine's Direct3D layer isn't an option, as it translates Direct3D calls to OpenGL calls.)

    If you're a graphics card manufacturer, you probably don't care; OpenGL has long allowed vendor-specific extensions. In fact, that's one of the ways OpenGL has evolved.
http://liquidat.wordpress.com/2008/08/1 ... -released/

Alex St John, ex-Microsoft employee
http://www.gamespot.com/news/6156565.html
http://zorful.blogspot.com/2009/08/john ... takes.html
  • John Carmack: One thing the D3D/GLQuake demonstration did was draw the lines of battle. Microsoft is always trying to be friendly and put on a good face and saying "We're doing what the ISVs want" and everything. But that's really just a front.

    There's a well-defined agenda that D3D shall rule the universe; OpenGL shall crumble and die. But Microsoft can't quite come out and say that. And I would respect them a hell of a lot more if they actually did, but they're trying to have your cake and eat it too. And it's just not that way.
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