Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

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Jim Shaffer
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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Jim Shaffer » Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:25 pm

Marziano wrote:
Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:57 pm
That's it! I have installed Mint without bootloader. After each time the kernel gets updated in Mint, I will boot into Manjaro and update the Grub from there which will capture the new kernel.
Well that sounds like an easy solution then! Me, I installed Mint first and Manjaro later (before Mint ever thought of dropping KDE -- I just wanted to see what it would be like using a rolling-release distro) and so I never thought of that.

KBD47
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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by KBD47 » Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:32 pm

If you installed the boot loader to root it should only update grub at root, say sdb1 for instance if that is where you installed the OS.

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Marziano » Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:34 pm

Jim Shaffer wrote:
Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:25 pm
Well that sounds like an easy solution then! Me, I installed Mint first and Manjaro later (before Mint ever thought of dropping KDE -- I just wanted to see what it would be like using a rolling-release distro) and so I never thought of that.
Yes, and so far it has worked well. You can create an EFI partition at the beginning of the disk for installing the bootloader from Manjaro. Then in which order you install Manjaro and Mint is irrelevant as long as you Install Mint without bootloader (running the installer from terminal~$ ubiquity -b). If you install Manjaro first, then you would need to boot into it and update the grub after the installation of Mint.
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them...well, I have others." -Marx...
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Retic1959
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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Retic1959 » Sun Jun 10, 2018 3:21 pm

tovian wrote:
Sat Jun 09, 2018 12:12 pm
I downloaded the Manjaro-KDE iso. I ran it a couple of times as a live session.
IT WAS FASTER ON MY MACHINE THAN ANY OTHER LIVE SESSION I HAVE TRIED !!
So I installed it.
It is NOTICEABLY FASTER than any of the other distro's I have ever used !! I am impressed. Also, I'm just having a lot of fun with it. Yes, it is a bit different than the Debian-based distro's, but it's still mostly intuitive (if you can run Synaptic then you can run Octopi). PLUS, the DE is KDE_Plasma and there are only a few minor differences in the Manjaro implementation.

I would NOT predict that Manjaro will run faster on everyone's computer, but it is definitely a treat on my testbed. Once I get all the standard packages updated I hope it won't slow down.

The Honeymoon isn't over yet - I always expect to find a few things that I don't care for. But, as of right now, I'm well on the way to having a new MAIN LINUX and would probably use Kubuntu as a backup/file-server.
It's good practice to check the announcement section under stable updates on the Manjaro forum before updating your system . This will let you know about any known issues and if any workarounds are required . So far in the last 18 months I haven't had to use a workaround but I still check to see if anything pertains to my system . Other than that if you decide to install a second distro it's best to install it without a bootloader and let Manjaro's grub handle everything . Glad to hear ypu're enjoying it . It's a great distro IMO .

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Retic1959 » Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:19 pm

Jim Shaffer wrote:
Sat Jun 09, 2018 7:25 pm
Marziano wrote:
Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:57 pm
That's it! I have installed Mint without bootloader. After each time the kernel gets updated in Mint, I will boot into Manjaro and update the Grub from there which will capture the new kernel.
Well that sounds like an easy solution then! Me, I installed Mint first and Manjaro later (before Mint ever thought of dropping KDE -- I just wanted to see what it would be like using a rolling-release distro) and so I never thought of that.
Another easy way to handle this if you already have Mint installed is after you install Manjaro , boot in to Mint and enter this line in the terminal replacing sdxy with the name of your Mint partition . sudo grub-install --force /dev/sdxy

That will prevent Mint's Grub from overwriting Manjaro's Grub , that's how I handled the situation . Along with updating Manjaro's grub after a kernel update in Mint of course .

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Marziano » Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:30 pm

Retic1959 wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:19 pm
... boot in to Mint and enter this line in the terminal replacing sdxy with the name of your Mint partition . sudo grub-install --force /dev/sdxy
That's great to know. Thanks for sharing!
Just for making sure if I get it correctly, the command line will force the grub to be installed to the root partition of the Mint?
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them...well, I have others." -Marx...
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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Retic1959 » Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:34 pm

Marziano wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:30 pm
Retic1959 wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:19 pm
... boot in to Mint and enter this line in the terminal replacing sdxy with the name of your Mint partition . sudo grub-install --force /dev/sdxy
That's great to know. Thanks for sharing!
Just for making sure if I get it correctly, the command line will force the grub to be installed to the root partition of the Mint?
Yup , no problems after that , been running that way for a year and a half now , makes it easier not to have to worry about it .

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Marziano » Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:39 pm

Retic1959 wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:34 pm
... makes it easier not to have to worry about it .
Sure it does! That's great, thank you!
Cheers
:D
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them...well, I have others." -Marx...
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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by SSudharaka » Mon Jun 11, 2018 8:46 am

Anyone tried installing KDE Plasma on top of Mint 19 XFCE yet?

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by famewolf » Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:04 pm

Well after all this talk about Manjaro I decided to put it in a VM to see how it compared with neon and have been impressed. Although officially Manjaro has dropped 32 bit manjaro32.org has picked up the slack using arch linux 32 bit as their upstream so your older hardware can still find an installer. It's very well done and for those who prefer a dark theme the default theme "Breath" can "go dark" if you choose that option from within "colors" in settings....there is no such thing as "Breath-Dark". The package manager is going to take some getting used to but as mentioned the gui tools are straightforward. Remembering to do "pacman -Ss whatever" instead of "apt-cache search whatever" will take some time. In the meantime a couple of cheatlists for command line are available here: [1 Page Cheatsheet] http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/pa ... tsheet.htm and Rosetta: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Pacman/Rosetta

I may have to try Manjaro on one of my laptop's. They only concern I have will be how the 32 bit version with xfce functions. Bodhi on an ubuntu base runs really well on limited resources but if I go to Manjaro I'd like everything to be on it.

A few things...apt-cacher-ng can be configured to work for both .deb's AND archlinux packages. The rolling release is really nice because I won't keep getting told I need to reinstall from scratch. The theme reminds me of my opensuse days (green based) where I also used a rolling distro (tumbleweed) for several years. It's running well in the VM so will continue experimenting with it. It also has some apps installed I'd not seen before so will have to compare them to my favs (comes with cantata music gui for MPD where I usually use clementine).

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by o-l-d » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:42 am

Plasma 5.13 what can I say? Both beautiful and fast!!! So sad Mint decided to drop KDE but Neon user edition has made a fine replacement!

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Retic1959 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:04 pm

o-l-d wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:42 am
Plasma 5.13 what can I say? Both beautiful and fast!!! So sad Mint decided to drop KDE but Neon user edition has made a fine replacement!
I won't see 5.13 as quick as you did on Neon , but I'll see it soon enough on Manjaro , and yup it's a shame Mint dropped the ball on KDE .

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by tovian » Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:21 pm

o-l-d wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:42 am
Plasma 5.13... ...Neon user edition
As a general rule I stay as far away from "bleeding edge" as I can, but I think this is where I'm headed next (or maybe stay with Kubuntu). I have seriously backed away from Manjaro. One of the reasons is the issue with Grub; another is the differences in Arch-Linux and its package managers vs Debian-Linux and its packaging software. I simply do not need complications like those in my life... I already have enough problems to deal with. Another issue that is THE show-stopper for me is that I joined their community and posted my first question on their board. The question wasn't particularly complex or difficult, but I really wanted to get a feel for how helpful their community is. The response I received was essentially, "here's a book, look it up". I was stunned - and quite disappointed. Their level of help for a "Newbie" was... absent !! Since we're all different I can hope they will treat everyone else better, but I will not get further involved in something I have lost confidence in and respect for. When one has been part of the Mint community one becomes spoiled... it can make other communities look pretty pathetic.

No more moaning&groaning about Manjaro - I'll just move on. And now I'll give the new NEON a peek.
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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Retic1959 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:13 pm

tovian wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:21 pm
o-l-d wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:42 am
Plasma 5.13... ...Neon user edition
As a general rule I stay as far away from "bleeding edge" as I can, but I think this is where I'm headed next (or maybe stay with Kubuntu). I have seriously backed away from Manjaro. One of the reasons is the issue with Grub; another is the differences in Arch-Linux and its package managers vs Debian-Linux and its packaging software. I simply do not need complications like those in my life... I already have enough problems to deal with. Another issue that is THE show-stopper for me is that I joined their community and posted my first question on their board. The question wasn't particularly complex or difficult, but I really wanted to get a feel for how helpful their community is. The response I received was essentially, "here's a book, look it up". I was stunned - and quite disappointed. Their level of help for a "Newbie" was... absent !! Since we're all different I can hope they will treat everyone else better, but I will not get further involved in something I have lost confidence in and respect for. When one has been part of the Mint community one becomes spoiled... it can make other communities look pretty pathetic.

No more moaning&groaning about Manjaro - I'll just move on. And now I'll give the new NEON a peek.
I read that thread , you were told which package to install which was everything you needed , and pointed to the documentation for it , Not here's a book , look it up . The person that answered you even apologised for his english not being good enough to write a tutorial for you . I don't blame the others for being upset with your response . Sad . https://forum.manjaro.org/t/how-to-run-samba/49388

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by tovian » Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:13 pm

Retic1959 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:13 pm
I read that thread , you were told which package to install which was everything you needed
I did install the package, I did read the documentation, I did solve the problem... but my feeling for how helpful they were - whether you and they like it or not - is that they were not even close to the help offered by most of the boards I have worked with. All their apologies make no difference to me - I shall not return to see them. I was not trying to flame them - I was just reporting on my experience. You, however, seem to be bending over backwards to flame me. I must thank you for that. I find it to be absolutely in keeping with my other experience with the aforementioned product. You have simply confirmed what I already felt. Again, thank you! :)

And, by the way, this right here is the end of the subject as far as I am concerned. Regardless of what is posted - here or there - from this point forward - I shall have no response. I do NOT participate in flame wars. If the entire world thinks I'm wrong then so be it... I'm OK with that, too.

Please move on.
“I think that this situation absolutely requires a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody's part!"
"We're just the guys to do it.”

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by famewolf » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:49 pm

See here's the problem. I could care less what you think of Manjaro, me or anything else but the comments you are making are misrepresenting things for OTHER people in THIS thread who want to consider Manjaro as an alternative. You obviously went into that forum with a chip already on your shoulder. The guy who answered was a non native english speaker and you basically jumped down his throat for not performing fast enough for you even though he's just another user and has nothing to do with the forum or Manjaro in any way. For the record I'm NOT a manjaro user and saying things like "I find it to be absolutely in keeping with my other experience with the aforementioned product. You have simply confirmed what I already felt. Again, thank you! " to people in THIS thread because they didn't agree with you is flat out stupid. *note* I said the actions were stupid, not that you were so don't accuse me of name calling.

I guess I can be living proof that kde neon users can disagree with you too. Their forum is a ghost town so you'll have to be prepared to hunt in the regular ubuntu forums so you probably won't like that either.

To anyone else worried about the package manager, octopi works pretty much like synaptic and yaourt has a bash "gui" menu where you pick your choice and it does whatever you need so you CAN muddle through. I've installed both Jdownloader and netspeed (kde speed widget) from the AUR and various packages using octopi in the vm I'm trying. I tried it on an older laptop just to get a feel for it on real hardware and did note one issue that ubuntu handled fine which it did not which was the b43-legacy wifi chipset I had in the laptop did not get auto setup probably due to missing firmware. I imagine they have the newer firmware on the installer. The live session DID get setup but the installed system did NOT so that's something to look out for. Both KDE-Neon and Manjaro look very polished.

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Retic1959 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:51 pm

tovian wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:13 pm
Retic1959 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:13 pm
I read that thread , you were told which package to install which was everything you needed
I did install the package, I did read the documentation, I did solve the problem... but my feeling for how helpful they were - whether you and they like it or not - is that they were not even close to the help offered by most of the boards I have worked with. All their apologies make no difference to me - I shall not return to see them. I was not trying to flame them - I was just reporting on my experience. You, however, seem to be bending over backwards to flame me. I must thank you for that. I find it to be absolutely in keeping with my other experience with the aforementioned product. You have simply confirmed what I already felt. Again, thank you! :)

And, by the way, this right here is the end of the subject as far as I am concerned. Regardless of what is posted - here or there - from this point forward - I shall have no response. I do NOT participate in flame wars. If the entire world thinks I'm wrong then so be it... I'm OK with that, too.

Please move on.
I'm not bending over backwards to flame you , you came on this forum and flamed a community that I know and respect . I'm relieved that you're not coming back and this is my last post on the matter , the thread speaks for itself .

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by BG405 » Sun Jun 17, 2018 9:01 am

I've been giving Manjaro a spin on my Acer D255E since I installed it late Friday night. Set up with a separate /DATA partition, containing a (fairly) recent backup of the LM17.3 KDE /home partition, brought it up to date last night. Quite impressed with it so far although there's a few teething problems to deal with.

Installed some packages I need, using pacman and yaourt including Waterfox which when synced incorporated all my add-ons. Waterfox shows Firefox in the titlebar - it does this on the other Acer with LM18.3 KDE, too - although with the Waterfox icon on both systems. It also didn't import the saved sessions, same as with the latter; this worked flawlessly on my Linux Mint 17.3 Cinnamon installation on the Dell Inspiron 1525. It does work with all the add-ons from FFv<57 and brings up the Waterfox homepage by default, suggesting it is actually indeed Waterfox, along with accidental FF browser launches missing the settings providing a fairly positive indication. However, having a newly-installed browser mis-identifying itself is unsettling. Not sure setting default browser will correct this if Waterfox "thinks" it is Firefox incl. settings. Will this just launch Firefox instead? Shouldn't be an issue though as profile directories are separate now?

VirtualBox needs a bit more work to get it going,

Overall it seems to work well, quite fast & responsive. Seems much quicker to respond than LM17.3 KDE 32-bit & using a significantly smaller memory footprint despite being 64-bit. The Manjaro Forums seem friendly and helpful too, even the thread linked above. It is likely my replacement OS for this computer .. plus no more reinstalls due to it being a rolling release, which suits me in this case.

Conclusion:
Manjaro + KDE, for me, looks like the best solution for my portable workhorse. It'll always be up-to-date without any significant downtime.

Posted from Manjaro installation.
Dell Inspiron 1525 - LM17.3 CE 64-------------------Acer D255E 2GB - LM17.3 KDE 32
Toshiba NB305 - LM17.3 Xfce 32---------------------K7S5A Athlon 1.2GHz - LM17.3 Xfce 32 & WinXP-Pro
Acer Aspire E11 ES1-111M - LM18.2 KDE 64 ----Dell PII 350 64MB - Puppy 4.3 & Win98-SE

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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by MtnDewManiac » Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:43 am

Retic1959 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:13 pm
I read that thread
I did, too, out of curiosity. Thank you for posting the link. I offer my thanks not because it provided information that I desperately needed or suchlike but, instead, because the next time I post a question (anywhere) and receive an answer that is somewhat less than comparable to mama bird catching, killing, eating, predigesting, and regurgitating food into baby bird's mouth, maybe the experience will cause me to exhibit a minimum of sense and to simply ask for clarification and additional information, if required, instead of acting like a spoiled child with a misplaced sense of self-entitlement.

Because I may or may not have done so in the past :lol: .

I failed to find anything wrong or even unduly rude about any of the replies. Even the "All good. I trust you can find your own way back to Ubuntu-land :roll: " one was pretty mild (and I had to chuckle at the fact that OP had actually been using an Ubuntu derivative (Mint) previously - although this did come with a tiny bit of feeling bad that another stereotype had been shown to be true (in this one instance)). This strikes me as being roughly comparable to the occasional one-word reply that I've seen get posted here in response to whiny members ("Bye.").

So: You have reminded me that I should strive to at least act mature when asking strangers for help. Again, thank you.

And that whole "strangers" thing, well, that seems like a pretty important concept to understand, here. Not more important than simple courtesy, perhaps - but still important, nonetheless. This is the Internet; it isn't the same as when you call your next door neighbor on Sunday morning and say, "Ed, I can't seem to get my water heater lit; do you have any tips?" Because while Ed likely knows you and, therefore, knows whether you are at least reasonably competent and possess a decent skill set or are one of those hapless individuals who cannot seem to figure out how to pour urine out of a boot even when the directions are printed on the bottom of it... The Internet does NOT.

If I ask "the Internet" how to do a thing, the people responding have no way of knowing what my level of knowledge is. Someone might post an answer that, while correct, I lack the knowledge to implement (or perhaps even to understand). Or they might assume that I know very little, less even than I actually do know - and post something basic. Both people are at least trying to be helpful - and should be appreciated for this. If my level of knowledge about a thing is low enough, I might need to learn a bit just to ask more pertinent questions. Et cetera.

I have little use for diplomats. Diplomacy, on the other hand...

Thanks again,
MDM
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Re: Preparing for Mint to drop the KDE distro

Post by Retic1959 » Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:07 am

MtnDewManiac wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:43 am
Retic1959 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:13 pm
I read that thread
I did, too, out of curiosity. Thank you for posting the link. I offer my thanks not because it provided information that I desperately needed or suchlike but, instead, because the next time I post a question (anywhere) and receive an answer that is somewhat less than comparable to mama bird catching, killing, eating, predigesting, and regurgitating food into baby bird's mouth, maybe the experience will cause me to exhibit a minimum of sense and to simply ask for clarification and additional information, if required, instead of acting like a spoiled child with a misplaced sense of self-entitlement.

Because I may or may not have done so in the past :lol: .

I failed to find anything wrong or even unduly rude about any of the replies. Even the "All good. I trust you can find your own way back to Ubuntu-land :roll: " one was pretty mild (and I had to chuckle at the fact that OP had actually been using an Ubuntu derivative (Mint) previously - although this did come with a tiny bit of feeling bad that another stereotype had been shown to be true (in this one instance)). This strikes me as being roughly comparable to the occasional one-word reply that I've seen get posted here in response to whiny members ("Bye.").

So: You have reminded me that I should strive to at least act mature when asking strangers for help. Again, thank you.

And that whole "strangers" thing, well, that seems like a pretty important concept to understand, here. Not more important than simple courtesy, perhaps - but still important, nonetheless. This is the Internet; it isn't the same as when you call your next door neighbor on Sunday morning and say, "Ed, I can't seem to get my water heater lit; do you have any tips?" Because while Ed likely knows you and, therefore, knows whether you are at least reasonably competent and possess a decent skill set or are one of those hapless individuals who cannot seem to figure out how to pour urine out of a boot even when the directions are printed on the bottom of it... The Internet does NOT.

If I ask "the Internet" how to do a thing, the people responding have no way of knowing what my level of knowledge is. Someone might post an answer that, while correct, I lack the knowledge to implement (or perhaps even to understand). Or they might assume that I know very little, less even than I actually do know - and post something basic. Both people are at least trying to be helpful - and should be appreciated for this. If my level of knowledge about a thing is low enough, I might need to learn a bit just to ask more pertinent questions. Et cetera.

I have little use for diplomats. Diplomacy, on the other hand...

Thanks again,
MDM
Hmmmmm , I wasn't aware of any stereotypes attached to Ubuntu/Mint users , interesting . There are still a lot of Mint fans on the Manjaro forums and Mint is fairly often mentioned as being one of the best distros on that board . Enlighten me about this stereotype , I could use a laugh . :D

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