Binning Windows 10

All Gurus once were Newbies
Forum rules
There are no such things as "stupid" questions. However if you think your question is a bit stupid, then this is the right place for you to post it. Please stick to easy to-the-point questions that you feel people can answer fast. For long and complicated questions prefer the other forums within the support section.
Before you post please read how to get help
Post Reply
totalloser
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:56 am

Binning Windows 10

Post by totalloser » Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:28 am

Hello Community :D

I'm a newbie - so newbie I'm as green as Mint :wink:

But I have an issue with Windows. I'm a graphic designer and bought and used my Surface Pro 4 for work purposes.

But 4 months out of warranty my battery stopped holding charge (it drains to flat within 24hrs) - I tried a ton of fixes and no joy, alot of people think it's a Windows 'instant connect' also 'house keeping' issue. Where the computer doesn't actually 'shutdown' it carries on in a passive sleep state.

I've always been interested in Linux and thought that I could kill two birds with one stone. Questions.

Is Mint Cinnamon compatible with a Surface Pro 4 - will the stylus work etc. Is it easy to get the drivers for the hardware? Will I need tons of drives for basic hardware for my Surface Pro 4 to run? (Told you I was a special kind of New Newbie)

I'm guessing that the Windows 'Hello' login feature will be saying a permanent goodbye ?

Another important factor I use Adobe Illustrator, Photoshop and Acrobat Pro. These obviously run on the Windows 10 platform but will they run on Mint. Or will I need a Linux version?

Thank you for your time people and I hope that you at least found my queries amusing :lol:

Have a lovely day, All the best, Total

gm10
Level 17
Level 17
Posts: 7162
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:11 pm

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by gm10 » Fri Jun 14, 2019 10:28 am

It should be supported in principle (including the pen) but lacking experience with the particular device and Cinnamon I'll let others comment on the details. I believe that you will need a series 4.18 or 5.0 kernel instead of the default 4.15 series kernel for a fully functioning standby feature but those are readily available for installation via Mint's Update Manager. I doubt that battery life will be significantly better though, usually Windows gets that quite right, but again, I lack first-hand experience with the particular device.

Regarding the Adobe software, Adobe is not offering Linux versions so you would either have to run alternative software, run it on Windows via a virtual machine or try your luck with the Wine/Crossover Windows compatibility layers.

Regarding Windows "Hello", that particular software will not work on Linux, of course, but all of the logon methods it offers are supported on Linux although you may need to install additional tools e.g. for the face recognition, it should not be included in the default configuration as far as I am aware (I never used the feature).
Tune up your LM 19.x: ppa:gm10/linuxmint-tools

Rocky Bennett
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 435
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 6:22 pm

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by Rocky Bennett » Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:11 pm

I can assure you that if you have your Windows 10 power config set up properly, when you shut off your PC it shuts OFF. I have a lot of experience with Windows 10 laptops and the battery is definitely not an issue. You can shut your PC off and store it for months and when you want, you can turn it on and the battery will still be good.

If your battery is over one year old you might need a new battery. I have had good luck with most batterys, maybe 4 or 5 years from one battery, but sometimes a battery can go out in as little as 6 months.

gittiest personITW
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 204
Joined: Tue May 28, 2019 4:27 pm

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by gittiest personITW » Fri Jun 14, 2019 5:10 pm

Can you try running a live distro from usb ?
You'll at least see if there are hardware issues.

If you are using the computer for work - its taken me a couple of weeks to move from Win to LM and had to learn a tonne of stuff.
On the whole I thouroughly recommend it, but it seems Gimp is the go to graphics package.

However, a quick search brings up https://www.educba.com/adobe-illustrator-for-linux/
for instance

User avatar
AndyMH
Level 7
Level 7
Posts: 1999
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:23 pm
Location: Wiltshire

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by AndyMH » Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:11 pm

If the Adobe software is a must have, then you have two choices:
  • Run them under wine (free) or crossover (non-free = the commercial version of wine). If it won't run under crossover, then it won't run under wine. You can find out what works here https://www.codeweavers.com/compatibili ... search=app. For example, it looks like all versions of illustrator are garbage except CS6 and there has been a recent post here saying CS2 works with wine.
  • Run win in a VM, e.g. virtualbox. The only issue here is speed, but I think the surface pro will be quick enough.
I do both, started with wine but thought it was worth paying for crossover, and also have win7 running in a VM. While there are linux equivalents to most windows stuff, if it is work related or you know the windows app inside-out, then similar isn't good enough. For example, there are 'good' alternatives to CorelDraw, but as I've been using it since version 1, I'm not about to change.
Homebrew i5-8400+GTX1080 Cinnamon 19.0, Thinkpad T430 i7-3632 Cinnamon 19.0, Thinkpad T420 Cinnamon 18.3, Thinkpad T410 Cinnamon 17.3, Thinkpad T60 19.0 Mate

Petermint
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 591
Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2016 3:12 am

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by Petermint » Fri Jun 14, 2019 11:29 pm

If you put Surface Pro in the title of this question, there is more chance of a Surface Pro owner seeing it.

Linux distributions do a good job of installing along side Windows. When you use a live boot version, you can often step part way through the install to see what it would do with the install. You could then see things like disk space usage.

Linux can use NTFS. Windows cannot see Ext4. A good approach is to have an NTFS data partition shared between both for projects where you access the one file from both operating systems. You might do that for all your documentation. Switch to LibreOffice on Windows and Linux.

Rocky Bennett
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 435
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 6:22 pm

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by Rocky Bennett » Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:10 am

The easiest thing for the OP to do is just buy a new battery. If he has a bad battery on his piece of equipment it is going to be bad no matter what OS he is running.

br1anstorm
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 308
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2014 8:53 am

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by br1anstorm » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:33 am

As a convert from Windows to Linux Mint, the last thing I'd normally do is discourage others from making the same move. But it does seem that in certain respects - notably graphics-heavy usage - Linux doesn't (yet) have the apps, programs or features to rival the specialist programmes available to Windows (or Mac?) users. Workarounds (Wine etc) are unlikely to be as convenient, and alternatives (Gimp?) not always appropriate.

It does look as if the OP's problem is a Win10 issue. Maybe just a failing battery. But a Google search on "Windows 10 battery drain" suggests that there are more fundamental problems. Not being a Windows user any more, I can't offer informed advice. But there are some useful diagnostic tips at https://www.howtogeek.com/241676/how-to ... indows-10/ .

It may be an off-the-wall thought, but I recall also reading somewhere that there are issues with the power and hibernation settings in Win10 - possibly linked to fast booting - where in effect shutting the computer down doesn't actually shut it off but keeps it on and idling so that it will start up again more quickly; and this configuration drains down the battery.

My advice? Dual booting is surely the way to go, if that's possible on a Surface Pro. Keep Win10 for the (few) purposes where work requires it, and discover the satisfaction of using Linux Mint for just about everything else!

User avatar
AndyMH
Level 7
Level 7
Posts: 1999
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 5:23 pm
Location: Wiltshire

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by AndyMH » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:10 am

My advice? Dual booting is surely the way to go
Agreed, when I started with mint that's what I did, but it was a lot easier to install dual boot with win7 than it is with win10 :( It was only later that I moved to using wine/crossover and then dumping win as a primary OS and running it in a VM.
Homebrew i5-8400+GTX1080 Cinnamon 19.0, Thinkpad T430 i7-3632 Cinnamon 19.0, Thinkpad T420 Cinnamon 18.3, Thinkpad T410 Cinnamon 17.3, Thinkpad T60 19.0 Mate

Rocky Bennett
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 435
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 6:22 pm

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by Rocky Bennett » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:37 am

I agree. There is no way for the OP to replicate his graphic arts functions that he has with Adobe Pro and Photoshop with any equivalent Linux apps, so dual booting Windows 10 and Linux Mint is a very good idea. After he buys a new battery he can then attempt to repartition his system and set up a nice dual boot PC.

Mark Phelps
Level 7
Level 7
Posts: 1846
Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 4:39 pm

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by Mark Phelps » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:04 pm

My experiences with Win10 and battery drain is that you will ALWAYS run down the battery -- no matter what settings you have.

The most common culprit is the new Win10 Hibernation setting known as Fast Startup -- NOT the same as Fast Boot -- which puts the laptop into a hybrid form of sleep when you turn it off.

In my case, even those I disabled this, my battery STILL drained such that, if the laptop needed to be stored more than a couple of weeks, I removed the battery.

Your experience, and that of others, might be different.

Petermint
Level 5
Level 5
Posts: 591
Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2016 3:12 am

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by Petermint » Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:48 am

Battery replacement in most machines is easy for anyone with a good toolset and no static electricity. There are tutorials online for the Surface pro 4.

Outside of the welded in place Apple devices, you can buy a replacement battery at a reasonable price because the batteries all come from the same small set of factories in China. You want one with the same capacity, not one of the cheap substitutes with less capacity.

Cases are often locked with a torx bolt. A hard core geek will have a set of the common sizes, like t7. Borrow their wrist strap to keep down the static. Lock out the children and pets who might eat the components. Vacuum clean the fan if there is one. Close the window if the surf is up as the spray contains salt.

Rocky Bennett
Level 4
Level 4
Posts: 435
Joined: Tue May 12, 2015 6:22 pm

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by Rocky Bennett » Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:01 am

Mark Phelps wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:04 pm
My experiences with Win10 and battery drain is that you will ALWAYS run down the battery -- no matter what settings you have.

The most common culprit is the new Win10 Hibernation setting known as Fast Startup -- NOT the same as Fast Boot -- which puts the laptop into a hybrid form of sleep when you turn it off.

In my case, even those I disabled this, my battery STILL drained such that, if the laptop needed to be stored more than a couple of weeks, I removed the battery.

Your experience, and that of others, might be different.


I maintain 6 Windows 10 laptops and this is an issue that I have never seen. With the Windows 10 laptops that I am charged to maintain, the battery will be strong for months if the PC is off and put away. A battery is cheap and can be easily replaced.

Batteries go out. It is a fact of life. Whether the laptop runs Ubuntu or Linux Mint or Windows, a good battery that holds a charge is essential.

totalloser
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:56 am

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by totalloser » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:38 pm

Thank you so much people for your helpful input - this whole thread has been very helpful and given me some great paths to follow.

Thank you again for your time :)

totalloser
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:56 am

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by totalloser » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:21 pm

Rocky Bennett wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:01 am
Mark Phelps wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:04 pm
My experiences with Win10 and battery drain is that you will ALWAYS run down the battery -- no matter what settings you have.

The most common culprit is the new Win10 Hibernation setting known as Fast Startup -- NOT the same as Fast Boot -- which puts the laptop into a hybrid form of sleep when you turn it off.

In my case, even those I disabled this, my battery STILL drained such that, if the laptop needed to be stored more than a couple of weeks, I removed the battery.

Your experience, and that of others, might be different.


I maintain 6 Windows 10 laptops and this is an issue that I have never seen. With the Windows 10 laptops that I am charged to maintain, the battery will be strong for months if the PC is off and put away. A battery is cheap and can be easily replaced.

Batteries go out. It is a fact of life. Whether the laptop runs Ubuntu or Linux Mint or Windows, a good battery that holds a charge is essential.
I think the above issues are both correct - The ' Fast Startup ' issue is definitely a problem for 'a lot' of Windows uses. I'm 95% sure me also - as this problem only started after a large Windows update. On my Surface Pro 4 which was sealed and boxed for a year and has only had moderate use for a year - battery life really should not be an issue and holding charge has improved with software changes. I do most of my work now on my old Acer Laptop (the beast) which is literary held together with tape its about 6 years old and runs Windows 10 and I can shut this computer down for over a week and still have 90% battery.

As other people have mentioned (sorry for not quoting you by name) "just replace the battery etc" - I get your point and yes - that would normally be my first port of call. But with a Surface to do so you need to:

Remove the screen which is heavily glued to the frame. with a heat gun and a delicate hand as the screen is easily cracked.

Remove all the components of the computer.

Then attempt to remove the battery which is glued (welded) to the inside back of the Surface Pro.

Its a massive 'dangerous' mission

Thanks for your heads up on the Adobe/ Graphic design issues that might arise with compatibility with Linux based OS - it's really given me some food for thought ...

Thank you again for your time and knowledge, its very much appreciated.

All the best Total

totalloser
Level 1
Level 1
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:56 am

Re: Binning Windows 10

Post by totalloser » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:24 pm

AndyMH wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 7:11 pm
If the Adobe software is a must have, then you have two choices:
  • Run them under wine (free) or crossover (non-free = the commercial version of wine). If it won't run under crossover, then it won't run under wine. You can find out what works here https://www.codeweavers.com/compatibili ... search=app. For example, it looks like all versions of illustrator are garbage except CS6 and there has been a recent post here saying CS2 works with wine.
  • Run win in a VM, e.g. virtualbox. The only issue here is speed, but I think the surface pro will be quick enough.
I do both, started with wine but thought it was worth paying for crossover, and also have win7 running in a VM. While there are linux equivalents to most windows stuff, if it is work related or you know the windows app inside-out, then similar isn't good enough. For example, there are 'good' alternatives to CorelDraw, but as I've been using it since version 1, I'm not about to change.
Thanks AndyMH :)

Post Reply

Return to “Newbie Questions”