Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Quick to answer questions about finding your way around LMDE as a new user.
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Distronaut
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Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Distronaut »

A question I've been thinking about for a while, my experience is that LMDE works just as good (if not better on at least my hardware) as the main flagship of Mint. Is there something I'm missing out by using LMDE? Except for the choices of the other two desktop environments Xfce (which I rather use since right now I'm not on the best computer) and Mate.

I have also come to understand that almost all of the focus goes into the Ubuntu based one, unless that's just a rumour, which got me thinking that maybe I should go back? And from what I have been reading regarding Ubuntu aswell have me thinking that I want to be on the Debian based one. The choice is hard to make. Do the Mint team actually really care about LMDE? Or is it just a "in case" scenario?
Last edited by LockBot on Sat Aug 19, 2023 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by MiZoG »

You can imagine that we had this debate, LMDE vs main Mint, many times before.
I myself could switch to LMDE anytime, I have both installed on different comps and both work well for me.
But objectively speaking, main Mint based on Ubuntu LTS still has some advantages.
1. Hardware support.
Ubuntu with its hardware enablement stack allows periodically updates during the lifetime of an LTS to support newer hardware.
"Driver manager" is an Ubuntu thing, still absent on Debian.
2. Kernel update management
Ubuntu has an edge over Debian and its "backports"
3. Third party repositories
Lots of ubuntu-specific PPAs out there not compatible with Debian. This has been mitigated by flatpak and other forms of distro-agnostic package management but alternatives may come with caveats.
So there are certain workflows, usages that still benefit from Ubuntu's way of doing things and MInt is "ubuntu done right". For mainstream users and newcomers to LInux, gaming is coming to mind first. Debian-stable is not ideal for them.
Last edited by MiZoG on Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by deepakdeshp »

If I have helped you solve a problem, please add [SOLVED] to your first post title, it helps other users looking for help.
Regards,
Deepak

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Mint 21.1 Cinnamon AMD Ryzen3500U/8gb
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by t42 »

Distronaut wrote: Sun Feb 19, 2023 9:37 pm Do the Mint team actually really care about LMDE? Or is it just a "in case" scenario?
The status of LMDE was many times clearly stated by Clem on the Linux Mint Blog, it's hard to believe it was missed by the experienced LMDE user.
LMDE receives adequate maintenance in full extent, e.g. see Monthly News – December 2022 – The Linux Mint Blog:
LMDE 5 is already up to date with Linux Mint 21.1, it received its backports just before the holidays. Some of the mint tools will be backported in Linux Mint 21 early this year.
The distribution choice maybe be highly subjective, especially when people trying seek for domination of the distribution they are using. Still, there are good observations in the post linked by deepakdeshp ( viewtopic.php?t=314843 ) which may help to resolve the alternative.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Moem »

t42 wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 6:56 am it's hard to believe it was missed by the experienced LMDE user.
Not all forum users are experienced Linux users, and newcomers are explicitly welcome on these forums. You're reading the Beginner Questions subsection; no need to expect anyone here to be an experienced user.
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If your issue is solved, kindly indicate that by editing the first post in the topic, and adding [SOLVED] to the title. Thanks!
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by t42 »

Moem wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:16 am...
Fair point, sorry!
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Moem »

😊👍
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If your issue is solved, kindly indicate that by editing the first post in the topic, and adding [SOLVED] to the title. Thanks!
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Distronaut »

MiZoG wrote: Sun Feb 19, 2023 11:43 pm 1. Hardware support.
Right, that one I knew about slightly, the thing is I am on a AMD. Shouldn't that be enough for me to be on LMDE? Doesn't that only apply for NVIDIA users?
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Distronaut »

deepakdeshp wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 12:16 am Please see viewtopic.php?t=314843
Thanks for the link to that thread, I will read the discussion there later!
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Tosh »

Why did I choose LMDE about a year ago. Needed a Linux to replace Win 10 which was going EOL in December 2022.

After trying Ubuntu 21.10 (the Gnome version) and finding it truly horrid I had no desire to jump onto a version of Mint that was based on Ubuntu. Thus I went to LMDE 4. It worked very well and even when LMDE 5 came out initially I felt no desire to upgrade. But about a month after LMDE 5 was released it was announced that LMDE 4 would go EOL in August and users should consider upgrading. Did a fresh install and it was useless form the start. It locked up every time I tried to open Libre Office and Chromium, 2 vital apps. Could not get any hints on the problem so gave up.

Did some Distro hopping and eventually for some unknown reason tried Ubuntu 22.04 Mate. It worked great except for the fact occasionally on boot up I got messages that various things had not loaded correctly (but even then it worked fine). Early August Mint 21 was released and I downloaded and installed the Mate version wondering if it had sorted the minor issues I was having with Ubuntu. In those 6 months its been perfect.

Personally I cannot see the point of LMDE for "normal" users. The full version of Mint is supported for 5 years, seems LMDE only gets about 2 1/2 years.

Just for the record I have installed Ubuntu Mate 22.1 on my RasPi 400 and never had any messages so it may be it was sorted before Mint Mate came out.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Distronaut »

Tosh wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:31 am Personally I cannot see the point of LMDE for "normal" users. The full version of Mint is supported for 5 years, seems LMDE only gets about 2 1/2 years.
I am gonna go back to their main version, either the Cinnamon/or Xfce Edition (have not decided yet) sometime this week, but if in the future LMDE become their main flagship, then I will go with LMDE. I'm too much of a newbie (as of now) to continue with LMDE. It's probably fantastic for those that know what they are doing.

All I really can say about LMDE is that it was a hassle uninstalling apps/packadges through synaptic, but the OS as a whole ran like a beast and were very snappy, bootup time much faster, maybe has to do with it being based off Debian. I did not really miss anything either in LMDE, everything was there.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by MiZoG »

With Debian stable you are stuck with obsolete Mesa drivers and that means forget about proper support of newer and in fact some not so new amd cards.
But of course this is just only a scenario to consider. Since you hardware is properly supported and you're not after the latest AAA game titles on steam/proton/whatever, you're just good to go with LMDE.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Distronaut »

MiZoG wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:12 pm With Debian stable you are stuck with obsolete Mesa drivers and that means forget about proper support of newer and in fact some not so new amd cards.
But of course this is just only a scenario to consider. Since you hardware is properly supported and you're not after the latest AAA game titles on steam/proton/whatever, you're just good to go with LMDE.
Thanks for the great explanation. I am on a 10 year old AMD, not at home as I'm writing this so can't drop the name of the AMD version. Only thing I'd do regarding gaming would be using emulators for retro gaming, I'll guess that would be totally fine? Not tried it yet however.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Tosh »

Distronaut wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:41 pm I'm too much of a newbie (as of now) to continue with LMDE. It's probably fantastic for those that know what they are doing.
I know nothing about the intricacies of setting up any Linux distro and with LMDE4 I had no issues at all. It worked strait out of the box. But LMDE5 was basically unusable (Libre Office and browser locked up whenever I tried to use them) and at the time I could get no help.

Ubuntu 22.04 Mate also had minor issues and again no help which is why I tried Mint Mate 21 which has been no problem even after I updated it to 21.1. Recently tried Mint 21.1 XFCE on an old external HD and that is also fine.

With LMDE 4 it may have been the fact that I installed it almost 2 years after it was released and the updates had ironed out any issues. But since it goes EOL 6 months after the next version is released it gives little time for any issues to be sorted, with the mainstream version you could wait almost 2 years before upgrading and still get 3 years support before going EOL.

Perhaps I should try the current version of LMDE5 to see if the issues I had are now sorted. A job for later.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Distronaut »

Tosh wrote: Wed Feb 22, 2023 4:41 am
Distronaut wrote: Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:41 pm I'm too much of a newbie (as of now) to continue with LMDE. It's probably fantastic for those that know what they are doing.
I know nothing about the intricacies of setting up any Linux distro and with LMDE4 I had no issues at all. It worked strait out of the box. But LMDE5 was basically unusable (Libre Office and browser locked up whenever I tried to use them) and at the time I could get no help.

Perhaps I should try the current version of LMDE5 to see if the issues I had are now sorted. A job for later.
I had no issues myself regarding LibreOffice (did not use it much but it worked just fine) or the browser (Firefox) in LMDE 5, so could be that the issues have been fixed. You should definitely check out LMDE 5 again.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by MLED4 »

LMDE is available on 32 bit, ubuntu no longer is.

I use asus eee pc 4G as pulseaudio receiver boxes, also as digital pic frames, kitchen clock and world-service radio players. These are 32 bit.
4 years ago, or so, when ubuntu was still available for 32 bit, I tried various distros, including ubuntu. The higher resource usage makes the fans scream. On a stripped down lmde install, the boxes are silent, which they need to be as music boxes.

Why not use fanless / pi etc you ask? An eee 4g on ebay can cost as little as £15. You might get an sbc for that, but add all the peripherals you need, and it costs twice as much, and also isn't really portable. Having a dozen or so, I can take two on holiday with me, plus six batteries, so I can use one while charging batteries with the other, and if one is lost or stolen or damaged or left in a cafe, no real loss.

Some things just can't be found as cheaply or quietly in 64 bit form.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by axisofevil »

I like stability, so I have used LMDE1,2,3,4,5 (over many years)

Whilst I have never needed some late version software, I could always run a distro in a VM.
I can run Mint in a VM - but it doesn't provide any additional functionality.

Going for the latest release of everything is very over-rated.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Tosh »

Distronaut wrote: Wed Feb 22, 2023 11:30 am You should definitely check out LMDE 5 again.
So last evening I spent a bit of time downloading LMDE5 and trying a live boot. This is on a 15 year old Dell Vostro 1700 with 2gb ram, a Core 2 Duo T8100 processor and NVIDIA G86M (GeForce 8400GS) graphics.

Got to the live session pretty quick and unlike early last year it did not lock up when I tried Libre Office or Firefox, something has been fixed. After a while I realised the fan was running and when I checked task manager (and I appreciate more resources are used in a live session) the memory was about 60% of the 2gb and the processors were at about 65 to 70%.

So a successful experiment.

While I was sat there I decided to try a Mint XFCE 21.1 USB I had created early February (to show the neighbour his old laptop still has life). Like LMDE5 it got to the live session OK and Libre Office and Firefox both ran fine. But no fan running so I checked task manager, memory at about 40% and processors at 10% ish.

I appreciate XFCE is lighter than Cimmoman but the difference surprised me.

With a bit of time to spare I dug out a 2010 vintage Samsung 250 gb HD and stuck it in the Vostro. Installed XFCE 21.1 on the laptop. Booted fine, went to bed.

Finished setting it up this morning. Libre Office works fine but whilst Firefox did not lock up the laptop it was so slow and unresponsive it was unusable (in the live session it was fine). Installed Chromium and its fine (used DuckDuckGo as the search engine on both).

Not heard the fan yet, system report says the processor is running at 37 degrees so that looks OK. At idle after boot its using about 1% processor and 22% memory.

So based on that until there is an LMDE with a lighter desktop I don't think I will be bothering again. Even then since XFCE is supported until 2027 and LMDE 5 goes EOL next year I cannot see any point for me. If I needed a 32 bit OS it may be a different matter but for me that is not the case.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by axisofevil »

A live run on a small memory model isn't going to give you much indication of how the installed version is going to run.
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Re: Why would you choose LMDE over the main flagship Linux Mint (Ubuntu)?

Post by Tosh »

axisofevil wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 7:04 am A live run on a small memory model isn't going to give you much indication of how the installed version is going to run.
I appreciate that which is why I quoted figures for live and installed for XFCE. Since LMDE5 was using more memory and processor live I would expect it to use more installed. No surprise to me since Cinnamon is the "flagship" desktop, if LMDE was available with XFCE DE it would no doubt be different.

But even if a LMDE XFCE version existed and it matched the "Ubuntu" version I could not see me ever converting because of the 2 1/2 year support.

I only tried LMDE this time last year after I had tried Ubuntu 21.10 Gnome and found it was totally unusable. I had used Mint before about 10 years ago and found it better than Ubuntu then and when I saw the LMDE version with no Ubuntu content it seemed to be what I was looking for. LMDE 4 worked well but I was shocked to find out it was going EOL in August which was why I installed LMDE and found it was unusable since Libre Office and Firefox locked the computer. Every other version of Linux I tried on this computer did pretty much the same (I assumed it was a kernel thing) so I gave up. Only now have I been successful on this machine. Mint Mate 21 has bee working great on my other laptop since August but that is a 2011 model with 8gb memory.

With 21.1 XFCE it seems my old Dell has some life lefty in it yet.
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